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  #1  
Old 05-09-06, 03:24 PM
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Mavs......Contenders or Pretenders

Be honest. What makes them either pretenders or contenders? I will start....I think they are pretenders. They are on the right track starting at the coaches positon, but I think they are missing some key pieces....link a dominant low post player. What do yall think?????
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #2  
Old 05-09-06, 03:26 PM
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They're a great team but we own them. Pretenders all the way. We're in their head like a giant tumor.
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  #3  
Old 05-09-06, 03:32 PM
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Pretenders-- til Dirk learns some legitimate post moves.
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Old 05-09-06, 03:39 PM
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they have to get past TD to become contenders
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  #5  
Old 05-09-06, 03:40 PM
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pretenders until timmy retires of course .Seriously their a helluva team deep and talented well coached but their not as hungry or experienced as the spurs. the big 3 along with guys like barry,finley,horry&vanexel are going to do everything in their power to get back 2 the finals and add another championship for this city. dallas has no idea what they got themselves into spurs r ready to take this thang to another level
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  #6  
Old 05-09-06, 03:50 PM
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I don't want to give material to the pro-Dallas trolls that are roaming around on Spurs report, but I can't label them pretenders. They won 60 games, they beat the top teams in the regular season, they swept the Grizzlies, and they played down to the wire against the Spurs. If they were to beat the Spurs, they would go all the way to the finals with a shot at beating Detroit. They have legitimate scorers and they can grind out wins.

That said, they must still beat the Spurs before they come here and talk smack. For me, the Pretenders are teams like the Heat, Cavs, and Suns. These are teams that got nice regular season win totals, but have no shot of winning the title. I think Dallas is much better then those teams. I know I am using regular season justifications, but I still think that they win play a competitive series w/ us and if they can do that, then they can do it against Detroit.
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  #7  
Old 05-09-06, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by To be named later
It is as if Dallas' championship hopes are directly tied to the Spurs.

It took some ex-Spurs like Avery Johnson and Joe Prunty to get the Mavs to the next level.

And Dallas will not get beyond the Spurs until the day Tim Duncan retires.

And as long as Bruce Bowen, who is 1/2 ft shorter and 45 lb's lighter can get in Dirks head and under his skin, the Spurs will continue to own the Mavs and break the hearts of Mavie fans everywhere.
I feel like your words should be placed on a plaque and hung in the Mavs locker room.
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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Old 05-09-06, 03:52 PM
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No, this isn't biased in anyway. OF course everyone is going to say pretender. Don't be stupid and think you are going to get an honest answer out of anyone here. Everyone WANTS the Spurs to win, so they will say that the Mavs are pretenders. This is an evenly matched series. The Spurs won the 1st game by 2 points with a chance to lose at the end. And also remember, both teams were pratically shut out the last 5 mins of the game.
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Old 05-09-06, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
No, this isn't biased in anyway. OF course everyone is going to say pretender. Don't be stupid and think you are going to get an honest answer out of anyone here. Everyone WANTS the Spurs to win, so they will say that the Mavs are pretenders. This is an evenly matched series. The Spurs won the 1st game by 2 points with a chance to lose at the end. And also remember, both teams were pratically shut out the last 5 mins of the game.
What's your point????? Do you have a point????? Much like the amount of Mavs championships...you have NONE.
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #10  
Old 05-09-06, 03:55 PM
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  #11  
Old 05-09-06, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
No, this isn't biased in anyway. OF course everyone is going to say pretender. Don't be stupid and think you are going to get an honest answer out of anyone here.
I say the Mavs are not pretender.
I'm a Spurs fan here.
This is an honest answer.

Conclusion? You're wrong. Deal with it.
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  #12  
Old 05-09-06, 03:58 PM
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The point is the same as it has always been. Spurs fans think they are entitled to an NBA championship every year. This is a new season, a new playoffs, different players on the teams. The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.
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  #13  
Old 05-09-06, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
The point is the same as it has always been. Spurs fans think they are entitled to an NBA championship every year. This is a new season, a new playoffs, different players on the teams. The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.
this is true in the future...but not now
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  #14  
Old 05-09-06, 04:00 PM
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contenders. doesn't make them champions, but they're a really good team. too bad for them that the spurs are better.
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  #15  
Old 05-09-06, 04:00 PM
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I think that the Mavs have the talent to beat the Spurs, but they have to prove they are mentally tough. Some of their players have bravado, like Stakehouse, but don't mistake foolish banter for mental toughness. Stakehouse talked a good game until he fired an airball three pointer in his pursuit of personal glory. He wanted to beat the Spurs bad that he didn't go for the OT, but straight for the buzzer beater.

Will other players make this same mistake when the game is on the line? The Mavs are a good team and not a pretender, but to be the best, you got to beat the best and we are the champs until they win. They must win the mental game to win this series b/c the Spurs are not afraid of the Mavs, but the Mavs have the Spurs in their minds. They can exorcise their demeans in this series, or they could fall short, just like Stackhouse's 3-pointer. I'll take the latter.
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  #16  
Old 05-09-06, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
The point is the same as it has always been. Spurs fans think they are entitled to an NBA championship every year. This is a new season, a new playoffs, different players on the teams. The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.

All good things come to an end. Will the Spurs stop winning titles? Eventually. Will the Mavs win a title? No time soon. Will the Mavs win a title this year? Not a chance in hell!!! Just as I thought...you have no point.
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #17  
Old 05-09-06, 04:02 PM
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contender: one that contends; especially : a competitor for a championship or high honor

Contender. Anyone who does what they've done this year is a contender. Whether they'll beat the other contender is still in question.
  #18  
Old 05-09-06, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
The point is the same as it has always been. Spurs fans think they are entitled to an NBA championship every year. This is a new season, a new playoffs, different players on the teams. The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.
It's more an expectation that our team wins b/c we have become accustomed to excellence in the post season. We expect to win every series. Dallas has yet to earn the respect of the fans on this site b/c they have yet to beat us or give us a tough series. That may change, but everytime we have played the Mavs, we have been confident of victory. If you look at last season's playoff series against Detroit, we had a little more circumspect b/c we respected their team...the defending champs. When you achieve what Detroit did, the fans here will respect your team.
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  #19  
Old 05-09-06, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
The point is the same as it has always been. Spurs fans think they are entitled to an NBA championship every year. This is a new season, a new playoffs, different players on the teams. The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.
Stop cryin'! You're on a Spurs Message Board tryin' to validate a team that's been a stepchild of the former for the last few years. WHY? What did you expect? Those who know the game meet somewhere in the middle of your opinion which is also biased and some of the biased opinions of some here. Deal wit' it!
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  #20  
Old 05-09-06, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightmkw
The point is the same as it has always been. Spurs fans think they are entitled to an NBA championship every year. This is a new season, a new playoffs, different players on the teams. The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.
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  #21  
Old 05-09-06, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by To be named later
sixeightmkw is just another in a long line of Mavs fans that come to SR looking for validation.

Sure, they may talk basketball and all, but what they really are here for is hoping to hear a Spurs fan compliment their team, give them praise, give them validation.

After all if a Spurs fan can give the Mavs praise, then they must be good!

It is sad and pathetic, but at the same time I can understand it.

Laker fans do the same thing.
I pity the Mavs fans. First there's the no championship thing. Now there's the being needy thing. Maybe someone can start a support group for them.
__________________
Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #22  
Old 05-09-06, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by To be named later
sixeightmkw is just another in a long line of Mavs fans that come to SR looking for validation.

Sure, they may talk basketball and all, but what they really are here for is hoping to hear a Spurs fan compliment their team, give them praise, give them validation.

After all if a Spurs fan can give the Mavs praise, then they must be good!

It is sad and pathetic, but at the same time I can understand it.

Laker fans do the same thing.
Lets see, the day after the win, about 20 new people signed up on our forum, many of them members here taunting and boasting and looking for the exact same thing, for someone to validate their team and make them feel good about themselves. I have come to mix things up. I could care less about what the spurs fans think of me or the Mavs. I know that no one in the media will ever care about the Mavs or any fans for that matter even if they win a championship. I have come to mix things up just like memebers on this forum have done on our site.
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  #23  
Old 05-09-06, 04:24 PM
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Are the Mavs really starting Devin Harris tonight?
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  #24  
Old 05-09-06, 04:36 PM
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Are the Spurs contenders?
If the Spurs are contenders then so are the Mavs,
The Spurs split the regular season 2-2, just ecked out a 2 point win at home.
Unlesss the Spurs up and beat the Mavs in 5 or 6 (This would please me greatly-but I think this is going to be a tough series a full 7 games) I think they are contenders. Do I think the Mavs have as good a chance as the Spurs to beat Detroit? No.
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  #25  
Old 05-09-06, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
The Spurs are a dying breed, same as the Bulls of old, the Celtics, the Lakers. The SPurs nice little run is coming to an end.
Oh brother. Go troll somewhere else

Dallas is a good team. I dont think they can beat the Spurs or win the championship this year. Call it what you want
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  #26  
Old 05-09-06, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by To be named later
Okay.....you have your wonderful regular season record, your victory against us April 7th in the AT&T Center, and Spurs fans signing up on your board after a Mavs LOSS.

We have three championships.

Hmmmm.......which is better?

Oh and those 20 new people werent there looking for validation......the Spurs had freaking BEAT YOU!!

They were there, I suppose, right or wrong, to taunt y'all and rub it in your face, not looking for validation.
Alright stop it........they hate it when you come at them with the truth. They whine.......WHY MUST YOU ALWAYS THROW THE CHAMPIONSHIPS UP IN MY FACE!!!!!!!!!! Booo Hooo!!!!!
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #27  
Old 05-09-06, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cd98
I think that the Mavs have the talent to beat the Spurs, but they have to prove they are mentally tough. Some of their players have bravado, like Stakehouse, but don't mistake foolish banter for mental toughness. Stakehouse talked a good game until he fired an airball three pointer in his pursuit of personal glory. He wanted to beat the Spurs bad that he didn't go for the OT, but straight for the buzzer beater.

Will other players make this same mistake when the game is on the line? The Mavs are a good team and not a pretender, but to be the best, you got to beat the best and we are the champs until they win. They must win the mental game to win this series b/c the Spurs are not afraid of the Mavs, but the Mavs have the Spurs in their minds. They can exorcise their demeans in this series, or they could fall short, just like Stackhouse's 3-pointer. I'll take the latter.
I see Horry going for the winner 3 instead of the tying 2. I don't think the decision in itself was a mistake. The difference is Horry makes that shot.
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  #28  
Old 05-09-06, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cd98
Are the Mavs really starting Devin Harris tonight?
yes, hes getting the start over adrian griffin.
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  #29  
Old 05-09-06, 08:27 PM
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i'm not sure what contender means.

if they made it to the finals.... they would get SHREDDED by the pistons. w/ no injuries, i would bet my house on it (actually i don't have a house, but sounds good).

but they are contenders in the sense that i beleive their defn the 2nd best team in the conference and in any given game they have a chance to beat the spurs.

over a 7 game series... they can't beat the spurs or pistons.

nor can any other team.

but they can certainly get hot from the field and win a few games... and compete. contend. ??
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  #30  
Old 05-09-06, 08:32 PM
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I don't think that the mavs are pretenders. I just don't think that they (or rather, their leader - dirk) have the mental toughness to contend. Statements like "I know I am not going to get 35 points a game in this series" is not what a true contender even thinks, much less, says. I would say that dallas is in limbo. They are not quite contenders yet but they are not pretenders.
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  #31  
Old 05-09-06, 10:57 PM
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Pretenders.

They are a very good team and finally seem to be on the right track after wasting Steve Nash and Michael Finley by employing Don Nelson far too long. His pase attitude toward defense and emphasis on high octane offense wasted some years where Nash, Finley and Nowitzki were all valuable contributors.

You don't win an NBA Championship by not playing defense.

Look at the last few NBA Championship teams:

Spurs (league leaders defensively)
Pistons (league leaders defensively)
Lakers (very solid defensive team; Kobe & Shaq All Defensive team))
Bulls (great defensive team with 3 All Defensive First teamers)
Rockets (solid defensive team;Olajuwon DPOY in '94)
Pistons (league leaders defensively;3 All Defensive players)


All of these teams had valued defensive players in their front court. Duncan, Robinson, Wallace, O'Neal, Rodman, Olajuwon, Thorpe, Mahorn, Lambieer.

Avery Johnson knows this and his rule from Day 1 has been to incorporate the defense first attitude that he has seen win 3 NBA Titles in San Antonio. He has done a wonderful job improving the Mavs defense in his first full-season as coach, but they still have a way to go to match the defensive intensity of the Spurs or Pistons.

Dirk Nowitzki is a big part of their success, but also a big part of their failures. Nowitzki is simply not a good defensive player. Unlike someone like Kevin Garnett, Rasheed Wallace or even Jermaine O'Neal - Nowitzki simply cannot guard Duncan in the post with any semblence of success. At 7 foot and with his versatile abilities, Nowitzki should dominate any player he matches up with. However, he is determined to shoot fade away jump shots and not get involved in a post battle with Duncan. When your best player cannot matchup with Duncan in the post - and you have no one else with any kind of ability to slow him down, you're going to find yourself up against it pretty quickly.

Dallas would benefit the most from having a post player whose primary mentality is defensive. A guy you can rely on to give you 10 points, 10 rebounds and solid post defense. He doesn't have to be an All Star player - but a solid role player that can backup Nowitzki in the paint and contain Tim Duncan. A player in the model of Horace Grant, Buck Williams, Charles Oakley or even Kurt Thomas would do wonders for the Mavs. He doesn't have to be a starter - but a weapon to use in post situations.

Eduardo Najera played this role for Dallas at one point with some success. He is a grunt player who gets after it defensively and this is what Dallas is missing most.

Dallas has a deep team full of swing people and may be better off moving one or two of those players to try to acquire such a player(s).

I'd consider moving Jason Terry as well. A traditional point guard capable of getting the ball to Nowitzki in a tough spot would benefit Dallas - but their need for a defensive post prescence is their most glaring weakness.

Dallas has taken huge strides this year defensively and Nowiztki has had a wonderful season, but they are still a player or two away from really, honestlly being able to challenge and defeat San Antonio or Detroit.

They may win a game or two from San Antonio in this series, but ultimately will lose this series.

They still need to change some personel and continue to change their mentality if they expect to ever beat San Antonio in the post-season. Until they do that, they are still just pretenders.

Last edited by RichB; 05-09-06 at 10:59 PM.
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  #32  
Old 05-10-06, 12:03 AM
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they are pretenders until they can win the WCF
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  #33  
Old 05-10-06, 12:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
Pretenders.

They are a very good team and finally seem to be on the right track after wasting Steve Nash and Michael Finley by employing Don Nelson far too long. His pase attitude toward defense and emphasis on high octane offense wasted some years where Nash, Finley and Nowitzki were all valuable contributors.

You don't win an NBA Championship by not playing defense.

Look at the last few NBA Championship teams:

Spurs (league leaders defensively)
Pistons (league leaders defensively)
Lakers (very solid defensive team; Kobe & Shaq All Defensive team))
Bulls (great defensive team with 3 All Defensive First teamers)
Rockets (solid defensive team;Olajuwon DPOY in '94)
Pistons (league leaders defensively;3 All Defensive players)


All of these teams had valued defensive players in their front court. Duncan, Robinson, Wallace, O'Neal, Rodman, Olajuwon, Thorpe, Mahorn, Lambieer.

Avery Johnson knows this and his rule from Day 1 has been to incorporate the defense first attitude that he has seen win 3 NBA Titles in San Antonio. He has done a wonderful job improving the Mavs defense in his first full-season as coach, but they still have a way to go to match the defensive intensity of the Spurs or Pistons.

Dirk Nowitzki is a big part of their success, but also a big part of their failures. Nowitzki is simply not a good defensive player. Unlike someone like Kevin Garnett, Rasheed Wallace or even Jermaine O'Neal - Nowitzki simply cannot guard Duncan in the post with any semblence of success. At 7 foot and with his versatile abilities, Nowitzki should dominate any player he matches up with. However, he is determined to shoot fade away jump shots and not get involved in a post battle with Duncan. When your best player cannot matchup with Duncan in the post - and you have no one else with any kind of ability to slow him down, you're going to find yourself up against it pretty quickly.

Dallas would benefit the most from having a post player whose primary mentality is defensive. A guy you can rely on to give you 10 points, 10 rebounds and solid post defense. He doesn't have to be an All Star player - but a solid role player that can backup Nowitzki in the paint and contain Tim Duncan. A player in the model of Horace Grant, Buck Williams, Charles Oakley or even Kurt Thomas would do wonders for the Mavs. He doesn't have to be a starter - but a weapon to use in post situations.

Eduardo Najera played this role for Dallas at one point with some success. He is a grunt player who gets after it defensively and this is what Dallas is missing most.

Dallas has a deep team full of swing people and may be better off moving one or two of those players to try to acquire such a player(s).

I'd consider moving Jason Terry as well. A traditional point guard capable of getting the ball to Nowitzki in a tough spot would benefit Dallas - but their need for a defensive post prescence is their most glaring weakness.

Dallas has taken huge strides this year defensively and Nowiztki has had a wonderful season, but they are still a player or two away from really, honestlly being able to challenge and defeat San Antonio or Detroit.

They may win a game or two from San Antonio in this series, but ultimately will lose this series.

They still need to change some personel and continue to change their mentality if they expect to ever beat San Antonio in the post-season. Until they do that, they are still just pretenders.
if i had any doubt about you before, you've definately solidified it with this post. wow, you obviously don't watch any mavs games. najera a good defensive player?

pass me some of what you're smoking.
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  #34  
Old 05-10-06, 12:38 AM
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Originally Posted by aexchange
if i had any doubt about you before, you've definately solidified it with this post. wow, you obviously don't watch any mavs games. najera a good defensive player?

pass me some of what you're smoking.
I'm not smoking a damn thing - I'm telling you the truth and you know it.

Do I watch 82 Mavs games a year? No. Did I say I did?

Did I ever say he was some great all-league defender? No.

I said he "played the role at one point with some success". The games that I saw him play, he was scrappy and did a helluva lot better job defensively than anyone else Dallas had at the time.

For arguements sake, take Najera's name out of my post - you have a better Mavs defensive player in mind? Replace Najera with that name.

Oh right. There isn't anyone else.

That's why the Mavs didn't win it then and why they won't win it this year.

Because your best player - is a puss.
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  #35  
Old 05-10-06, 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted by RichB
...Eduardo Najera played this role for Dallas at one point with some success. He is a grunt player who gets after it defensively and this is what Dallas is missing most.

Dallas has a deep team full of swing people and may be better off moving one or two of those players to try to acquire such a player(s).

I'd consider moving Jason Terry as well. A traditional point guard capable of getting the ball to Nowitzki in a tough spot would benefit Dallas - but their need for a defensive post prescence is their most glaring weakness...
Wow.
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  #36  
Old 05-10-06, 01:52 AM
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Originally Posted by capitalcity
Wow.
If you disagree, then please do us this favor and elaborate.

Please enlighten us on what we don't know about the Dallas Mavericks.
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  #37  
Old 05-10-06, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by RichB
Pretenders.

They are a very good team and finally seem to be on the right track after wasting Steve Nash and Michael Finley by employing Don Nelson far too long. His pase attitude toward defense and emphasis on high octane offense wasted some years where Nash, Finley and Nowitzki were all valuable contributors.

You don't win an NBA Championship by not playing defense.

Look at the last few NBA Championship teams:

Spurs (league leaders defensively)
Pistons (league leaders defensively)
Lakers (very solid defensive team; Kobe & Shaq All Defensive team))
Bulls (great defensive team with 3 All Defensive First teamers)
Rockets (solid defensive team;Olajuwon DPOY in '94)
Pistons (league leaders defensively;3 All Defensive players)


All of these teams had valued defensive players in their front court. Duncan, Robinson, Wallace, O'Neal, Rodman, Olajuwon, Thorpe, Mahorn, Lambieer.

Avery Johnson knows this and his rule from Day 1 has been to incorporate the defense first attitude that he has seen win 3 NBA Titles in San Antonio. He has done a wonderful job improving the Mavs defense in his first full-season as coach, but they still have a way to go to match the defensive intensity of the Spurs or Pistons.

Dirk Nowitzki is a big part of their success, but also a big part of their failures. Nowitzki is simply not a good defensive player. Unlike someone like Kevin Garnett, Rasheed Wallace or even Jermaine O'Neal - Nowitzki simply cannot guard Duncan in the post with any semblence of success. At 7 foot and with his versatile abilities, Nowitzki should dominate any player he matches up with. However, he is determined to shoot fade away jump shots and not get involved in a post battle with Duncan. When your best player cannot matchup with Duncan in the post - and you have no one else with any kind of ability to slow him down, you're going to find yourself up against it pretty quickly.

Dallas would benefit the most from having a post player whose primary mentality is defensive. A guy you can rely on to give you 10 points, 10 rebounds and solid post defense. He doesn't have to be an All Star player - but a solid role player that can backup Nowitzki in the paint and contain Tim Duncan. A player in the model of Horace Grant, Buck Williams, Charles Oakley or even Kurt Thomas would do wonders for the Mavs. He doesn't have to be a starter - but a weapon to use in post situations.

Eduardo Najera played this role for Dallas at one point with some success. He is a grunt player who gets after it defensively and this is what Dallas is missing most.

Dallas has a deep team full of swing people and may be better off moving one or two of those players to try to acquire such a player(s).

I'd consider moving Jason Terry as well. A traditional point guard capable of getting the ball to Nowitzki in a tough spot would benefit Dallas - but their need for a defensive post prescence is their most glaring weakness.

Dallas has taken huge strides this year defensively and Nowiztki has had a wonderful season, but they are still a player or two away from really, honestlly being able to challenge and defeat San Antonio or Detroit.

They may win a game or two from San Antonio in this series, but ultimately will lose this series.

They still need to change some personel and continue to change their mentality if they expect to ever beat San Antonio in the post-season. Until they do that, they are still just pretenders.


Quote:
Originally Posted by evenstar
they are pretenders until they can win the WCF


In order to be the Champs you have to beat the Champs in a seven game series. The Mavs have yet to do that.
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #38  
Old 05-10-06, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
If you disagree, then please do us this favor and elaborate.

Please enlighten us on what we don't know about the Dallas Mavericks.
enlightening you is going to be a difficult challenge. much like trying to pull hairs from a bald man's head or trying to win an ass kicking contest with one leg, but what the hell, i'll give it a whirl.

the mavs haven't been able to trade for a top flight defensive front court player due to what it would take to get someone like that. probably some combination of josh howard and devin harris. those two players are arguably the most talented players behind dirk and are the future pieces of the franchise. in lieu of mortgaging their future, the mavs have stockpiled big men.

dampier/diop/mbenga, while also adding dirty work guys like adrian griffin and hustle guys like darrell armstrong. dampier/diop/griffin all know their role, and they perform that role adequately. are they superstars? no. are they counted upon to be superstars? no. (although dampier would think he is a star, but i digress...)

Quote:
Dallas would benefit the most from having a post player whose primary mentality is defensive. A guy you can rely on to give you 10 points, 10 rebounds and solid post defense. He doesn't have to be an All Star player - but a solid role player that can backup Nowitzki in the paint and contain Tim Duncan. A player in the model of Horace Grant, Buck Williams, Charles Oakley or even Kurt Thomas would do wonders for the Mavs. He doesn't have to be a starter - but a weapon to use in post situations.
first of all, no one is going to contain tim duncan. not when he's healthy, which he looks to be. hes a bonafide performer, but in addition to that his footwork is too good to really ask your big men to shut down the premier post player in the game. what dampier and diop have done relatively well prior to this series though, is making duncan work relatively hard to score his points. whether thats a result of duncan's foot injury in the regular season remains to be seen, but duncan has been nothing short of a beast in the postseason.

that being said, dampier has been solid. not spectacular. not great. but solid. he's clogging up the lane, he's grabbing boards, and he's putting in the effort. he got into some foul trouble in game 2 that took him out of the game, but in game 1, he had 10 boards and 5 blocks. you can't ask for much more than that.

Quote:
I said he "played the role at one point with some success". The games that I saw him play, he was scrappy and did a helluva lot better job defensively than anyone else Dallas had at the time.

For arguements sake, take Najera's name out of my post - you have a better Mavs defensive player in mind? Replace Najera with that name.
sorry, this is where you lost credibility in my mind. najera may very well be one of the most overrated players in Mavs history. he would have trouble grabbing 10 rebounds against the freaking undersized suns let alone against a bruising bigger team like the spurs. najera is a poor man's version of malik rose. and by poor i mean beggar. and by beggar, i mean harold miner was a poor man's version of michael jordan. sure it'd be nice if we have a oakley in his prime, but in the absence of that, i'll take a diop/dampier combo over najera anyday. najera isn't going to be of any help trying to defend the post. and in regards to defending the perimeter, the mavs have pretty decent players in daniels/howard/harris.

Quote:
Do I watch 82 Mavs games a year? No. Did I say I did?
this is what cracks me up. you admit you don't watch many mavs games, yet thread over thread, you summarily dismiss the mavs as pretenders time after time. then you spew some unintelligable garbage about adding najera as a defensive presence. that's your prerogative and i guess the mavs will have to beat the spurs to change your tune. that's fine.

i'll now wait for you to post oversized pictures of tim duncan, as is your habit. or we can attempt to engage in an intelligent conversation. i suspect however, i'll be sorely disappointed.
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  #39  
Old 05-10-06, 01:43 PM
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They're contenders for sure. But we're stronger contenders and will demolish them come saturday.
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  #40  
Old 05-10-06, 01:48 PM
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mavs will be pretenders until their best player knows how to play defense
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  #41  
Old 05-10-06, 01:55 PM
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In this league, sometimes you have to trade value to get value. No one is going to give you what you need the most. Trading Howard or Harris may be the only way to acquire the kind of defensive prescence Dallas needs. Teams do it all the time - take one step back to take two steps forward.

You're not going to get the job done with the bigs you have now. Of course, no one can completely shut down Duncan - but he's abusing the Mavs bigs.

Diop and Dampier are simply not going to get it done against Duncan and even if by some act of God they were able to beat the Spurs, would be mince meat at the hands of the Pistons. Perhaps you feel they are adequate. This series will painfully demonstrate to you they are not adequate enough.

I'll take your opinion of Najera as being more valid than mine. I didn't watch every single game he played for the Mavs. But what I saw of him, he hustled and worked hard. He got after it on the defensive end and wasn't afraid to mix it up in the paint, unlike a certain blond seven footer on your roster.

I don't watch 82 Mavs games a year, but I do watch them when they're on TV. I'm an NBA fan - so I make it a point to watch games when I can, no matter who is playing. I've watched them over the last 5 years because they have appeared on national television more and more often.

I stand by my opinion. I have seen absolutely nothing to lead me to believe that Dallas can beat San Antonio 4 times in 7 games. Nothing.

This series will prove that emphatically and you'll serve up some mild concession afterward, that the Spurs were the better team and how we should expect even more from the Mavs next year, yada yada yada. End of Mavs season.

Instead of leaving you with an oversized picture of Tim Duncan, I'll leave you with a visual that will define this series. Your own head coach - helpless.

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  #42  
Old 05-10-06, 02:06 PM
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so who is giving (gave) the spurs a more difficult time? the kings or mavs?
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  #43  
Old 05-10-06, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by magnificent
so who is giving (gave) the spurs a more difficult time? the kings or mavs?
It's too early to tell. We went thru something similar with the Kings from the standpoint of they thought they should have won the game on the last minute shot by Bones.....just like the Mavs thought they should have won game 1. Still.......too early to tell.
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Hibbert, who worked out with Duncan in San Antonio during the lockout, said he has grown close to the perennial All-Star. On Friday, he texted Duncan and asked how he should guard him.

"He said, 'Go for every pump fake,' " Hibbert said.
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  #44  
Old 05-10-06, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by magnificent
so who is giving (gave) the spurs a more difficult time? the kings or mavs?
I was more flustered with the Kings. We didn't have the players to truly match up with Artest or Wells. We do have the players to match up with Howard, Dirk, Devin, Stackhouse and all the other chumps. Dallas is a good team. But for some reason, they don't worry me as much.
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  #45  
Old 05-10-06, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by magnificent
so who is giving (gave) the spurs a more difficult time? the kings or mavs?
Go away already.
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  #46  
Old 05-10-06, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by magnificent
so who is giving (gave) the spurs a more difficult time? the kings or mavs?
I would say Kings, they are a very athletic bunch and their swingmen destroyed us.

Allas is still Allas, their D is vastly overrated, and I don't think, I KNOW the Spurs will end this series in 6 games.
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  #47  
Old 05-10-06, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by DunkinDan89
I would say Kings, they are a very athletic bunch and their swingmen destroyed us.

Allas is still Allas, their D is vastly overrated, and I don't think, I KNOW the Spurs will end this series in 6 games.
They sure did stop us last night. I hate dallas as much as anyone, but you have to give them their props. They're a good team and we shouldn't just brush them off. These are not the mavs of '03. That being said, let's go step on their throats.
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