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  #1  
Old 04-03-06, 05:05 PM
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Manu future Hall-of-Famer

I was just thinking seeing as how the Basketball Hall of Fame isn't purely NBA Manu would probably be a future inductee. Considering he has won Euroleauge championship, NBA championship, and Olympic gold medal. I know it's early but the other day BSPN was talking about the HOF possibilities and they had the likes of ZO and Grant Hill going.
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  #2  
Old 04-03-06, 05:08 PM
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Bill Walton made it in based more on his college stats than his pro stats, so anything's possible.
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  #3  
Old 04-03-06, 05:09 PM
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We discussed this last summer, did we not?

Based on both careers - Manu Ginobili has a great shot at it.
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  #4  
Old 04-03-06, 05:10 PM
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Agreed
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  #5  
Old 04-03-06, 05:16 PM
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Maybe
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  #6  
Old 04-03-06, 05:26 PM
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Question: Who selects the Basketball HoF inductees? I have pretty good idea of how the baseball and football halls work, but I don't hear much about the selection process for the basketball hall. Any insights spurs fans?
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  #7  
Old 04-03-06, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
He has an EXTREMELY good shot at it.

NBA Champion (twice so far)
Euroleague Champ (twice)
Olympic Gold

No player in the world has EVER had a resume like that one.
Yeah but - and no offense to Euroleague - the Olympic Gold/NBA Champion thing is what really stands out. And of those, to be honest, the Olympic Gold stands out more because as long as he's on the Spurs he'll always be in TD's shadow. Beating Team USA and getting Argentina its second gold and first in basketball, that's just the real clincher for me.
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  #8  
Old 04-03-06, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
He has an EXTREMELY good shot at it.

NBA Champion (twice so far)
Euroleague Champ (twice)
Olympic Gold

No player in the world has EVER had a resume like that one.
He won the Euroleague only once.

That's right, he's the only player in BB history who has ever won those 3 titles.
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  #9  
Old 04-03-06, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
My mistake, I thought he won back to back Euroleague titles.
He won the Euroleague in 2001 and lost the final to Panatinaikos (Greece) in 2002, always with Kinder Bologna (Italy).

You were right about his unique resume.

Literally unique.
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  #10  
Old 04-03-06, 06:12 PM
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Don't forget the MVP awards...
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  #11  
Old 04-03-06, 06:22 PM
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...he might have deserved Finals MVP last year
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  #12  
Old 04-03-06, 06:28 PM
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After Manu which other foreign star is a future hall of famer? I'd say Dirk followed by Sabonis and maybe Yao.

Last edited by Silver Samurai; 04-03-06 at 06:30 PM.
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  #13  
Old 04-03-06, 06:36 PM
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Bodiroga might make it based on his European resume.
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  #14  
Old 04-03-06, 07:14 PM
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if manu gets two more championships, is in two more all star games, and raises his scoring average to 20 pts, he'll get into the hall of fame just on his nba career. for the subjective stuff like other championships won, i have no idea.

here are some future hall of famers:
jordan
shaq
karl malone
tim duncan
hakeem
pippen
iverson
kobe
drob
garnett
grant hill
ewing
stockton
webber
kidd
payton
carter
pierce
tim hardaway
mcgrady
steve francis (believe it or not)
marbury (again, believe it or not)
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  #15  
Old 04-03-06, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Samurai
After Manu which other foreign star is a future hall of famer? I'd say Dirk followed by Sabonis and maybe Yao.
i would think that Sabonis is getting in for sure. wasn't he like really big overseas then came here after he was all old and broken down so that is why we don't see him like others do?
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  #16  
Old 04-03-06, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spurs fan removed
i would think that Sabonis is getting in for sure. wasn't he like really big overseas then came here after he was all old and broken down so that is why we don't see him like others do?
Nash, seeing as how he'll probably pick up his second MVP this year.
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  #17  
Old 04-03-06, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaceman Spiff
Nash, seeing as how he'll probably pick up his second MVP this year.
Having played at such a small school in college (Santa Clara) makes him completely dependent on his pro numbers to get him there, so I think he still has some work to do to get there considering that it took until about his 4th season before he started putting up good numbers.

edit: I looked up his career stats and he doesn't have 10,000 pts and 5000 assists reached yet, and he didn't reach a double figure scoring average until his 5th season...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/player...s?statsId=3103
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  #18  
Old 04-03-06, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spurtime
Having played at such a small school in college (Santa Clara) makes him completely dependent on his pro numbers to get him there, so I think he still has some work to do to get there considering that it took until about his 4th season before he started putting up good numbers.
I see what you mean, but two MVP's and redefining a style in the NBA warrant it, IMO. And he was by no means a bad PG in Dallas either. I don't think his college career should set him back at all, and they actually had a huge upset in the NCAA tournament, if I remember correctly. He'll probably also be recognized as the best basketball player to ever come from Canada. He'll have 5000 ast by the end of the year and reach 10,000 points next season.

Other stuff:
4 time All-Star
1st ever Freshmen MVP of the WCC tourney (did it a few times)
As a 15 seed, led Santa Clara to a win over #2 seed Arizona, as a 10 seed a few years later beat #7 seed Maryland.
First player to lead WCC in points and assists since John Stockton.
Captained Team Canada in Sydney Olympics in 2000.
Tournament MVP of Olympic Qualifiers in Puerto Rico.
4th PG ever to win MVP.
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Last edited by Spaceman Spiff; 04-03-06 at 08:05 PM.
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  #19  
Old 04-03-06, 09:53 PM
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15 Gold Medals (not to many altough)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason R
... Beating Team USA and getting Argentina its second gold and first in basketball, that's just the real clincher for me.
Excuse me, but If you refered to all the gold medal Argentina had won in the olimpics history, you´re wrong... Argentina had won 15 (2 in the last one, bball and soccer).
that´s all, thanks...
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  #20  
Old 04-03-06, 09:56 PM
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I'm sure Jason R meant its second gold of that olympics...don't see why it would be misconstrued to mean "of all time"
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  #21  
Old 04-03-06, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Samurai
After Manu which other foreign star is a future hall of famer? I'd say Dirk followed by Sabonis and maybe Yao.
Parker isn't a HOFer yet. But he will be.
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  #22  
Old 04-03-06, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaceman Spiff
I'm sure Jason R meant its second gold of that olympics...don't see why it would be misconstrued to mean "of all time"
because if you say "first one in basketball" you are referening "of all time".
but please don´t make a topic out of this...
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  #23  
Old 04-03-06, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave McNulla
if manu gets two more championships, is in two more all star games, and raises his scoring average to 20 pts, he'll get into the hall of fame just on his nba career. for the subjective stuff like other championships won, i have no idea.

here are some future hall of famers:
jordan
shaq
karl malone
tim duncan
hakeem
pippen
iverson
kobe
drob
garnett
grant hill
ewing
stockton
webber
kidd
payton
carter
pierce
tim hardaway
mcgrady
steve francis (believe it or not)
marbury (again, believe it or not)
Got to have my say on this list.

Retired Players

Hakeem Olajuwon,Patrick Ewing - Class of 2007.
Michael Jordan, John Stockton, David Robinson - Class of 2008
Karl Malone, Scottie Pippen - Class of 2009
Reggie Miller - Class of 2010.
Tim Hardaway - No way in hell. Decent numbers, but no major achievements.

Shaq, Duncan, Garnett, Kidd, Kobe, Iverson, and Payton - First Ballot locks.

Alonzo Mourning - Borderline selection. Not First ballot - but probably gets in.
Dirk Nowitski - Too early to tell still. May have to win an Olympic Medal or an NBA Championship to warrant consideration right now. Not a lock by any means.

Webber - Probably not. Good numbers but probably on the outside looking in.
G Hill - No way. Injury robbed him of a HOF career.
Carter - A poor man's Dominique Wilkins, but probably not. Needs to win big in the next 3-4 years. Possible - but a long shot.
Pierce - A Joe Dumars type with better numbers, but rarely on a winning team. Uphill climb for him at this point in his career.
McGrady - Too early to tell, but if he can lead Rockets to a championship - he may get in. But still too early to tell.
Francis - No way in hell whatsoever. Has done absolutely nothing to even be considered in this conversation.
Marbury - See Steve Francis.
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  #24  
Old 04-03-06, 10:36 PM
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^I second that.
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  #25  
Old 04-03-06, 10:39 PM
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I say Manu is not a half of famer....
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  #26  
Old 04-03-06, 10:41 PM
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considering its not just a NBA hall of fame...I see no reason Manu wont end up being one when he retires
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  #27  
Old 04-03-06, 10:44 PM
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I am going just by the NBA ....
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  #28  
Old 04-03-06, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALSPURS
I am going just by the NBA ....
If you go strictly by his NBA career - no, he probably isn't.

Good thing for Manu, that the Hall isn't an NBA Hall of Fame - it's a Basketball Hall of Fame.

So limiting his viability to his NBA career is essentially pointless.

As I said before, based on his career as a whole which is how the Hall will judge him - he's got a good shot at it.
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  #29  
Old 04-03-06, 11:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manumaradona
Excuse me, but If you refered to all the gold medal Argentina had won in the olimpics history, you´re wrong... Argentina had won 15 (2 in the last one, bball and soccer).
that´s all, thanks...
The second gold was meant to mean that they came on the heels of the other gold they got the same year.

I thought this was their first bbal gold medal in the Olympics... if I'm wrong then I apologize.
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  #30  
Old 04-03-06, 11:55 PM
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RichB, I still can't convince you on Nash?

If he wins another MVP, would you give it to him?
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  #31  
Old 04-03-06, 11:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason R
The second gold was meant to mean that they came on the heels of the other gold they got the same year.

I thought this was their first bbal gold medal in the Olympics... if I'm wrong then I apologize.
You're not wrong, it WAS Argentina's first baskeball olympic medal... let alone gold.

You're both saying the same thing but the wording it getting on the way.
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  #32  
Old 04-04-06, 12:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaceman Spiff
RichB, I still can't convince you on Nash?

If he wins another MVP, would you give it to him?
I didn't mean to, but I completely overlooked him. But again, he isn't a player that immediately pops into my head as a great player or a future Hall of Famer.

Plus - he wasn't on Dave McNulla's list and that's what I was looking at.

If he wins a 2nd MVP - I'd have to give it to him. Although before last season - he would have been in the Tim Hardaway category IMHO.
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  #33  
Old 04-04-06, 01:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
Got to have my say on this list.

Retired Players

Hakeem Olajuwon,Patrick Ewing - Class of 2007.
Michael Jordan, John Stockton, David Robinson - Class of 2008
Karl Malone, Scottie Pippen - Class of 2009
Reggie Miller - Class of 2010.
Tim Hardaway - No way in hell. Decent numbers, but no major achievements.

Shaq, Duncan, Garnett, Kidd, Kobe, Iverson, and Payton - First Ballot locks.

Alonzo Mourning - Borderline selection. Not First ballot - but probably gets in.
Dirk Nowitski - Too early to tell still. May have to win an Olympic Medal or an NBA Championship to warrant consideration right now. Not a lock by any means.

Webber - Probably not. Good numbers but probably on the outside looking in.
G Hill - No way. Injury robbed him of a HOF career.
Carter - A poor man's Dominique Wilkins, but probably not. Needs to win big in the next 3-4 years. Possible - but a long shot.
Pierce - A Joe Dumars type with better numbers, but rarely on a winning team. Uphill climb for him at this point in his career.
McGrady - Too early to tell, but if he can lead Rockets to a championship - he may get in. But still too early to tell.
Francis - No way in hell whatsoever. Has done absolutely nothing to even be considered in this conversation.
Marbury - See Steve Francis.
not my names, it's theirs based on thier calculations. i think there are weaknesses in using something like their formula, mostly that it's treated as an nba hall of fame. seondly, that it treats players careers all the same, even if they started slow and finished poorly (like finley's will be down at the end). third, that it doesn't take into consideration anything subjective that doesn't get recorded, or many mainstream stats like steals, blocks, etc.
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  #34  
Old 04-04-06, 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason R
Yeah but - and no offense to Euroleague - the Olympic Gold/NBA Champion thing is what really stands out. And of those, to be honest, the Olympic Gold stands out more because as long as he's on the Spurs he'll always be in TD's shadow. Beating Team USA and getting Argentina its second gold and first in basketball, that's just the real clincher for me.
What do you mean with second gold?

EDIT: I am sorry, I didn't read all the thread before asking. Was confusing. I am sorry again.

Last edited by bonnington; 04-04-06 at 05:29 AM.
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  #35  
Old 04-04-06, 08:14 AM
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I'd say that today, as of now, Manu is a lock for the HOF.

The HOF is full of ex-NBA guys who made the HOF simply because they made a few all star game appearances.

In my book, each one of Manu's Euroleague MVP's, equates to several NBA all star game appearances. And leading his teams to Euro championship, NBA championship, and Olympic Gold, each of those are greater than any single NBA A/S games.

What I'm saying is if players get into the HOF for a few AS game appearances, the equivalent wise Manu has already achieved more.
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  #36  
Old 04-04-06, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
He has an EXTREMELY good shot at it.

NBA Champion (twice so far)
Euroleague Champ (twice)
Olympic Gold

No player in the world has EVER had a resume like that one.


this is why im greatful the fans dont select for HOF's. id rather have 5 NBA championships rather than 2 nba titles a euro title and an olympic gold. the best players dont even play in the world championships. totally exclude that.
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  #37  
Old 04-04-06, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnificent
this is why im greatful the fans dont select for HOF's. id rather have 5 NBA championships rather than 2 nba titles a euro title and an olympic gold. the best players dont even play in the world championships. totally exclude that.
You would say that since your team has never won sh!t.
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  #38  
Old 04-04-06, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnificent
this is why im greatful the fans dont select for HOF's. id rather have 5 NBA championships rather than 2 nba titles a euro title and an olympic gold. the best players dont even play in the world championships. totally exclude that.

Thing is, the HOF selection board doesn't work on NBA achievements alone. THE bball HOF is widely known for their preference of amateur and other non-NBA bball achievements. In fact, the board consists mostly of foreign commitee members.

So Manu probably would get more votes than a player with only 5 NBA titles.

THE HOF selection committee is notorious for these type actions.
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  #39  
Old 04-04-06, 08:31 AM
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what does that have to do with the sacramento kings?
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  #40  
Old 04-04-06, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnificent
what does that have to do with the sacramento kings?
A question I ask myself quite often.....particularly when we are discussing NBA achievements.
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  #41  
Old 04-04-06, 08:40 AM
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Heck, Drazen Petrovic is a HOF.

Manu has two methods of entry into the HOF as there are four screening committees:
1. USA;
2. Women;
3. Veterans (an individual whose career ended 35 years before his/her nomination);
4. International.
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  #42  
Old 04-04-06, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
What part of "the HOF is not just for NBA achivements" did you not understand?

And by your criteria, the Kings will never have a HOFer. Ever.
They've already had one of the absolute best: Oscar Robertson.

Two other HOF greats also played for the franchise, Tiny Archibald and Jerry Lucas.

And honestly, I think Mitch Richmond has a very solid shot at making the Hall of Fame.

The guy played in relative obscurity in Sacramento but was always a rock solid player (hence the nickname "The Rock") and repeatedly praised by HOFers like Jordan, Drexler and Miller as a tough, tough matchup.

Not a first ballot guy - but I can absolutely see him getting in at some point.

1989 Rookie of the Year, 2-time Olympian (1 Bronze, 1 Gold)
6-time All Star, 5-time Alll NBA
Averaged over 20 PPG for the first 10 seasons of his career.
21.PPg; 3.5 Apg; 3.9 Rpg
20,000 career points, 3,000 asists, 3,000 rebounds.


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  #43  
Old 04-04-06, 12:39 PM
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I feel he's already deserving, but one more NBA title SOLIDIFIES it for Manu.
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  #44  
Old 04-04-06, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnificent
this is why im greatful the fans dont select for HOF's. id rather have 5 NBA championships rather than 2 nba titles a euro title and an olympic gold. the best players dont even play in the world championships. totally exclude that.
Yeah, the best players even don't play at the world championship and olympics
I am so tired of heard loser words.
Man, you must show respect.

The world is more than the US, The Basketball is more than the NBA, and If the Olympic gold doesn't mean anything, why your players were so upset, why your media was so upset, why your fans were so upset?

Show respect.
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  #45  
Old 04-04-06, 12:49 PM
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It's the fox and the grapes, bonnington.
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  #46  
Old 04-04-06, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mg06
It's the fox and the grapes, bonnington.
Yeah, And I was thinking the same, I didn't post what i was thinking because I don't want to get banned.
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  #47  
Old 04-04-06, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bonnington
I didn't post what i was thinking because I don't want to get banned.
Thank you for the endorsement... and goodbye...
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  #48  
Old 04-04-06, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mg06
Thank you for the endorsement... and goodbye...

You are not going to get banned by that tale, but if I said that he is plain s****d, i don't know
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  #49  
Old 04-04-06, 04:14 PM
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I think Manu is a lock HOF

Oscar Schmidt, from Brazil, is on the HOF. He had a GREAT carrer in Europe and in Brazil NT but he never played in NBA and never won an Olympic medal.
__________________
"We would have two less championships here if it wasn't for Manu Ginobili," Popovich said. "In my book, Manu Ginobili is the stud of the world.
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  #50  
Old 04-04-06, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurs Brazil
I think Manu is a lock HOF

Oscar Schmidt, from Brazil, is on the HOF. He had a GREAT carrer in Europe and in Brazil NT but he never played in NBA and never won an Olympic medal.
Go tell Magnificent
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