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  #1  
Old 10-04-05, 07:38 PM
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Amare a legend in the making?

Amare Stoudemire inked his contract extension today that will keep him in a Suns uniform through at least the 2009-2010 season (with an option for the 2010-2011 season).

This was pretty much a formality. Now, Amare can concentrate on taking the Suns on his back for the next six seasons.

Here’s what Suns fans have to look forward to over the next six seasons:

-At least one title

-A perennial MVP candidate, expect Amare to win one or two MVP’s

-Moving back to the PF position, expect Amare to usurp Duncan or Nowitzki at the forward position on the 1st All-NBA team for the next six years

-Scoring titles galore; Amare’s going to scrape 30ppg this season with Q and JJ gone. Expect him to be in the running for a scoring title every season

Amare is a legend in the making. I’m glad to have him on board for at least the next five years.


This was posted by a suns fan on his website. I was just throwing it out there to see if anyone agrees with him.
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  #2  
Old 10-04-05, 07:44 PM
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If he can continue to expand his game (and yes, that means playing defense) to coincide with his amazing athleticisn - he'll be an MVP type player in no time.

Of course, that's not saying much - given that award is not what it once was. Thanks Steve Nash.

If Stoudamire can match his amazing atheltic gifts with poise, intelligence and a willingness to improve and make others better - he will be an elite player for years to come.

He still has a way to reach the Duncan/Garnett level - but he is certainly on his way.
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  #3  
Old 10-04-05, 07:50 PM
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I know he will be a great player one day but I don't see them winning a title in the next six years. The only advantage for the suns came when the Lakers broke up and it didn't help them to get rid of one of their better players. Garnett hasn't even won one yet.
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  #4  
Old 10-04-05, 08:01 PM
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Nash will turn 32 in February...the window of opportunity for the Suns isn't that wide given Nash's age...unfortunately, their window overlaps with the Spurs entering their prime...it might be premature to anticipate a championship within the next 6 years...could happen, but a lot of things will have to go right for them...
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  #5  
Old 10-04-05, 08:06 PM
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He needs to learn how to anchor a defense before he gets to the realm of big men MVP´s like Robinson, Duncan, Hakeem, Garnett, Shaq.
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  #6  
Old 10-04-05, 08:26 PM
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Amare needs to learn how to play defense first

and its way premature to be talking about the Suns winning titles

I cant see them ever winning a title under D'antoni

let the guy win something before handing him legend status
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  #7  
Old 10-04-05, 08:27 PM
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I absolutely love Amare's game.

The way he takes the ball to the rim with power and force, as well as his jumper was sick last year on the Spurs in the WCF. If he can keep from being such a headcase about it and really, really show improvement from last season (like he needed to already), he's definelty a legend.
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  #8  
Old 10-04-05, 08:35 PM
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I dont think the Suns have a team right now to win a title

I think they can get back to the WCF but I dont think the moves made this summer made them a better team than last year

now what happens in the next 5 years or so is unknown...however

The Spurs are entering their prime in terms of contenders in the NBA for the next several years...As long as Duncan, Manu and Parker are together their going to be serious title contender every year.....so what amare does to take them to a title remains to be seen

Nash also isnt getting younger. I dont think you can just assume the Suns win a title or two in the next few seasons
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  #9  
Old 10-04-05, 08:41 PM
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I think they will maybe win a title once the wheels finally fall off the Nash-train, and they switch to a defensive-minded system led by Marion and Amare (hopefully a good defender by then) and a bunch of roleplayers who can defend.
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  #10  
Old 10-04-05, 08:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obijon80
Well, I'm not really a baseball fan, since the Spurs get all my attention. But the playoffs start tonight, and Chicago (south side) is all excited because the Sox have a chance to win their first postseason series since 1917. Plus I see the Sox stadium every day sinse I go to school on the south side.

The colors are similar to the Spurs. The slogan is similar to "Go Spurs Go." Why WOULDN'T I root for 'em?!

Tonight. Game 1. White Sox vs. Red Sox. Go Go White Sox.
His jumper's erratic but he has shown a willingness to improve. Legend? That might be a little strong but I do think he'll end up somewhere in the Hall Of Fame.

But what will happen to him once his athleticism is gone? Same as DRob I guess.
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  #11  
Old 10-04-05, 08:47 PM
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True. I'd say that's what defines Amare's game. What would he be like without athleticism? Hmm...I do look forward to the new moves he's worked on ...
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  #12  
Old 10-04-05, 08:49 PM
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Amare is tremendous. I think he's coming around at a bad time, though. If the Spurs do as well as they should over the next four or five years, then the Suns may become the early 90s Jazz - a great team with HOF players who never get a ring.

At least that's what I'm hoping for...
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  #13  
Old 10-04-05, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
in the next 4-5 though I can defenitly see them wining a title.
depends. I think the Spurs are going to make it very tough for any team to get out of the west for the next 4-5 seasons while Duncan and the core is together. Im not saying the Spurs will win the next 5 titles but I think SA can win another title or two with this core. the Spurs have their key pieces locked up for awhile.. not the best time for the Suns to be embarking on some title run

I like Amare...but Im not ready to put him in the LEGEND catagory yet

Quote:
Now we learn he's hitting 3s consistently.
I'll believe Amare is going to reguarly take and make the 3 this season when I see it
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  #14  
Old 10-04-05, 08:56 PM
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Tony Parker is OLDER than Amare???? That's hard to believe.
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  #15  
Old 10-04-05, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
Of course, that's not saying much - given that award is not what it once was. Thanks Steve Nash.
Why don't you direct your ire at the sportswriters? All Nash did was play his best basketball. It's not like he openly lobbied for the award.

Anyway, about the points the Suns fan makes:

Quote:
-At least one title

-A perennial MVP candidate, expect Amare to win one or two MVP’s

-Moving back to the PF position, expect Amare to usurp Duncan or Nowitzki at the forward position on the 1st All-NBA team for the next six years

-Scoring titles galore; Amare’s going to scrape 30ppg this season with Q and JJ gone. Expect him to be in the running for a scoring title every season
1) Without a committment to defense, the Suns aren't winning anything. No team is going to All-Star Game its way to a title, especially considering what firepower they've lost.

2) The MVP is definitely a strong possibility, but I personally would like to see double-digit rebounds from a player that big and strong with that kind of explosion.

3) Amare is not usurping Duncan anytime soon, but Garnett is the player Amare will have to surpass. He's not quite there yet

4) Scoring titles are for guards - they control the ball more than bigs. There are a lot of young guards around who really can fill it up.

This is all splitting hairs. Amare may become a legend, maybe not - but he's all stud and the Suns are lucky to have him.
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  #16  
Old 10-04-05, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DizzG
Amare needs to learn how to play defense first

and its way premature to be talking about the Suns winning titles

I cant see them ever winning a title under D'antoni

let the guy win something before handing him legend status
WORD
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  #17  
Old 10-04-05, 09:47 PM
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keep in mind people the suns lost 2 really good perimeter players in Johnson and Richardson which allowed Amare the freedom to operate last season... defenses will focus on him much more this season around... how well Amare imrpoves his passing game and getting others involved will be the key on offense... something DROB was very good at.

lets see improvement on his passing, as well as a commitment to defense before we start mentioning him in the same breath as Robinson and legends
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  #18  
Old 10-04-05, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
If he can continue to expand his game (and yes, that means playing defense) to coincide with his amazing athleticisn - he'll be an MVP type player in no time.

Of course, that's not saying much - given that award is not what it once was. Thanks Steve Nash.
Steve Nash doesn't dunk, so he mustn't be all that, right?

Amare is going to be very good. He already is very good and he's jsut figuring things out. He'll figure out how to play defense. Whether or not he finds the right teammates to play alongside him determines whether or not he will win a title.
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  #19  
Old 10-04-05, 09:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
^^That would be why the thread is titled 'legend in the MAKING"
true, but im reading Drob comparisons and at 23 he not even close to a "legend in the making" ... btw many teams will be happy to see Amare camping out on the 3 point line.
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  #20  
Old 10-04-05, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
With that athletiscm, there is no way he will be camping at the 3 point line. Where did you get that from? Its another weapon for him, which is bad news for everyone.
Quote:
If he can hit 1/2 a game at 35% then it will be enough. On the break he can either spot up and take the 3 (if people are waiting in the lane) or if the guard the arc, blow by them and dunk. Just more problems for defenders.

on the break?? as a coach, i would want Amare presenting himself as an option in the keyway. leave the spotting up for your guards.
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  #21  
Old 10-04-05, 10:05 PM
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also if im guarding amare at the 3 point line , i give him a lot of room and dare him too shoot... no way you close check an un-proven Amare at the 3 point line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
You read half the quote. Go back and try again.
i know what im reading ... im trying to inform you it would be silly to go away from the strengths of the guy that made him a 60% shooter and take away dynamic that makes Amare and the Suns so dangerous in the keyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carnac The Magnificent
. Whether or not he finds the right teammates to play alongside him determines whether or not he will win a title.
good point .. i forgot to mention it also depends on your teammates to deliver if and when he passes out.
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  #22  
Old 10-04-05, 10:10 PM
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Its nice to see we all haven't forgotten about the suns but will they make it to the playoffs in the top 3 this year?
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  #23  
Old 10-04-05, 10:11 PM
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Even if he starts hitting 3's consistently, I still see him as a KG-type player, and we've all seen that before...
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  #24  
Old 10-04-05, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
KG can't put 40 on Tim for 5 games. Not even when Tim was hurt.

The guy is special....I used to rag on him, but after that performance in the playoffs I can't. He's the real deal and will only get BETTER.
Maybe so but his shot is still ugly.
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  #25  
Old 10-04-05, 10:26 PM
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Legends are MJ, Larry, Magic, Russell, Wilt.

Amare has a chance to become special, but legends are the guys mentioned above.
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  #26  
Old 10-04-05, 10:27 PM
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KG never tried when Tim was on two busted ankles. Besides, what people miss in that WCF finals series is that Amare wasn't the Spurs top priority. Not even close. What the Spurs wanted to do was disrupt Nash and keep the entire offense from engaging. Amare can only hurt you with the ball, Nash can kill you left and right. They singled Amare with a guy on two bad ankles to GOAD him into doing exactly what he did. Going ballistic on the points, contributing very little to overall team success. You'll note that despite Amare's dominance Suns went down in 5? The Spurs let him have his way and instead neutralized the entire rest of the team, and it was a highly effective defensive strategy. Amare is good no doubt, even amazing, but his performance in the WCF had more to do with the Spurs defensive schemes than just pure talent and skill on his part.
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  #27  
Old 10-04-05, 10:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
KG can't put 40 on Tim for 5 games. Not even when Tim was hurt.

The guy is special....I used to rag on him, but after that performance in the playoffs I can't. He's the real deal and will only get BETTER.
sure...but lets tap the breaks before putting him up with the NBA legends

he has a ways too go to prove he has overtaken Duncan or to even come close to Duncan accomplishments
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  #28  
Old 10-04-05, 10:44 PM
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Why doesn't anyone write a thread titled "Duncan a legend?"
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  #29  
Old 10-04-05, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
KG can't put 40 on Tim for 5 games. Not even when Tim was hurt.

The guy is special....I used to rag on him, but after that performance in the playoffs I can't. He's the real deal and will only get BETTER.
I don't think Amare could either. He scored 10-12 a game simply on the Duncan switch to Nash, remember? It completely took the Suns out of their rhythm trying to exploit mismatches, and Amare got more than a few easy ones because of the philosophy. I do think he'll be fighting LeBron for MVP's for the next decade though.
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  #30  
Old 10-04-05, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DizzG
sure...but lets tap the breaks before putting him up with the NBA legends
But apparently it's OK to name Tony Parker the elite point guard of the NBA before he's ever suited up.
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  #31  
Old 10-04-05, 10:57 PM
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Legends aren't one sided. Amare Stoudemire has to do more than just score for his team to be a legend. The kid is damn amazing but he has still a lot to prove.
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  #32  
Old 10-04-05, 11:08 PM
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D'Antoni will continue to hold the team back. He has a childish mentality and can't continue to grow the team.
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  #33  
Old 10-05-05, 12:03 AM
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Look the fact of the matter is that Amare is very young and although Nash is getting older,

he has been mentoring Barbosa to take over one day. Nash will probably serve the role

of Kerr like role off the bench then. So, to not give them the benefit of the doubt of

being in contention for the Title within a year (except this year) or so is rediculous.

All it would take is an injury to TD, Manu, Shaq or even Big Ben to give anyone,

especially the Suns a shot at the title.

Hey, you never know the Stars could line up just right for them one day,

just as they have for our Spurs.

Last edited by stuffedmushroomz; 10-05-05 at 12:07 AM.
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  #34  
Old 10-05-05, 12:15 AM
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Amare has great talent. Due to his age, he can flat out abuse his athleticism to get by people. *BUT*, he's not nearly as effective if he doesn't have a guy like Nash next to him. For proof, look at last season while Nash was out. Also, he needs to work on his fundamentals more, because he ain't going to stay athletic for the rest of his life. Plus his defense is still suspect. But those are things that can be corrected, and there's no doubt he has talent.
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  #35  
Old 10-05-05, 12:35 AM
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Dominique Wilkins in a bigger body! He can fill it up but does he do enough to make the team better because he is out there? Tim Duncan is special because he can score 15 points and have more impact on the final score than Amare can by scoring 40. MJ could score at will but it wasn't until he realized that the game requires more that he became great. After 4 years it appears the lesson Amare has learned is that if he can make some 3 pointers he will REALLY be feared.
It isn't the points dummy, it is the rest of the game. Rebounds, blocks, picks, when to involve a teammate, when to spend some extra energy on defense.
Nash won the MVP last year (argue what you want) because his play made a bunch of good players great. Amare doesn't appear to have that intangible in him. Friggin freak; I love to watch him play though.
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  #36  
Old 10-05-05, 01:02 AM
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People refuse to get credits where its due.

Amare's already a top 10 player, and I have no reason to doubt that he'll continue to improve every single freaking year.
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  #37  
Old 10-05-05, 01:27 AM
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Ok but the topic is if he will be a legend like Tim or David.
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  #38  
Old 10-05-05, 01:53 AM
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Question: Is Amare today, better than a young Shawn Kemp was when he was in his youthfull prime?

(If you only remember the Shawn "Makin' babies and Gettin' high" Kemp, after he earned the nickname Reignman, don't bother answering.)
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  #39  
Old 10-05-05, 02:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by To be named later
Question: Is Amare today, better than a young Shawn Kemp was when he was in his youthfull prime?

(If you only remember the Shawn "Makin' babies and Gettin' high" Kemp, after he earned the nickname Reignman, don't bother answering.)
Probably. Kemp never averaged over 20.5 a game (and that was with Cleveland during the lockout shortened season). Kemp was far more effective in the fast break, whereas Amare can be a formidable half court player as well. Amare is more durable, a better shot blocker, and a smarter player altogether.
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  #40  
Old 10-05-05, 06:15 AM
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We'll see how Amare does after this year now that his team really needs him to step up with key players gone. After this season we will see who he should be compared to but it sure won't be Tim.
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  #41  
Old 10-05-05, 06:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesR
If that jumper gets as consistent as it was in the WCFs, he could be pretty good older.

I remember laughing in Game 1 when he hit a couple of Js.."Hahaha, that wont last." Hit some more, hit some more, hit some more. Then dunk on everyone. Now we learn he's hitting 3s consistently. Fu'ck. I don't think they are a danger to the Spurs, but my God what a talent.
I remember thinking the same.

I think, if he continue playing like that he will be a legend sooner or later.
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  #42  
Old 10-05-05, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carnac The Magnificent
But apparently it's OK to name Tony Parker the elite point guard of the NBA before he's ever suited up.
no one here that I can remember called Parker a "legend" or the best point guard in the NBA

saying he was one of the better PG's in the league last year is a lot different than that

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alamo Girl
People refuse to get credits where its due.

Amare's already a top 10 player, and I have no reason to doubt that he'll continue to improve every single freaking year.
who isnt giving him credit? I dont think anyone has said he isnt an excellent player

but putting near overtaking Duncan at this point or talking about the multiple titles he is going to take the Suns to is premature.....esp with the Spurs core locked up for the next several years...and other teams like Houston improving as well
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  #43  
Old 10-05-05, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justbarbour
D'Antoni will continue to hold the team back. He has a childish mentality and can't continue to grow the team.
very true, and what is this I hear about Amare working on 3's this summer?
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Old 10-05-05, 10:14 AM
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I want to see if Amare becomes a leader because right now he is still a man-child. He has an athletic game not a thinking game. Tim, Garnet, and Dirk are all thinkers with hi BB IQs i don't think Amare has shown that yet. He hasn't had to lead his team since he had Marbury and Nash so its unfair to measure his leadership but you can look at his game and easily see that its based on athlesticism. Lets see how he matures before we label him a great one.

No doubt about it though, he will be the premier PF as tim/garnett/dirk/ start to show their age. he already lit up Tim in the playoffs (i know stopping amare wasn't our defensive focus).
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Old 10-05-05, 10:18 AM
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if amare was a spur he would be a legend in the making
but since he plays for another team he is not



certain players are superstars and they do not play d

all this crap if he does not play d he will not be a legend is stupid
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  #46  
Old 10-05-05, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by JamesR
Amare scored 40 on Tim with Nash only having 3 assists. I think he'll do fine--and the team as well if he continues his growth on both sides of the ball.
Yes but at the time Duncan was on two sore ankles and couldn't play his usual defense.

Amare needs to become a better defender and as long as they are playing run and gun Bball i don't think that is going to improve much. They'd need to change their game philosophy for Amare to really understand the defense game. Also to reach the MVP status he needs to become the leader of the team, set the example and make the others around him better. Somehow with Nash on the team i don't see him taking the effort to be the on-floor team leader. As far as a championship, unless the team as a whole improves their defense for the next few years teams like SA and Det will oust them. I think at the moment even Miami would beat them in a series.
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Old 10-05-05, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by DULESfreestyler
keep in mind people the suns lost 2 really good perimeter players in Johnson and Richardson which allowed Amare the freedom to operate last season... defenses will focus on him much more this season around... how well Amare imrpoves his passing game and getting others involved will be the key on offense... something DROB was very good at.

lets see improvement on his passing, as well as a commitment to defense before we start mentioning him in the same breath as Robinson and legends


WORD......Life will become more hell for him in the paint; Who is their 3-point threat other than Nash? It damn sure isn't Bell or Barbosa....James Jones was a benchwarmer w/the Pacers last year....
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  #48  
Old 10-05-05, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks
if amare was a spur he would be a legend in the making
but since he plays for another team he is not
Sometimes I wonder what people here would say about Tim's game if he wasn't a Spur. Choker at the FT line? Doesn't dunk the ball enough? Shouldn't be shooting 17ft jumpers ever? Soft?



Quote:
certain players are superstars and they do not play d

all this crap if he does not play d he will not be a legend is stupid
Well, there aren't too many All-Time players that did not play D. Magic Johnson was one, but he made everyone else better on O and defended out of his PG position on D. Then you have Dominique Wilkins and Bernard King, both left out of the Top 50 list and both still awaiting HOF status.

If you really believe defense wins championships, then Amare is taking a detour on his way to true greatness. Oh, his D will come in time....but then why doesn't he work on it right now? Why did he ask for Kurt Thomas to be traded here, instead of assuming the defensive responsibility for himself?
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  #49  
Old 10-05-05, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by austin_spurs_fan
I want to see if Amare becomes a leader because right now he is still a man-child. He has an athletic game not a thinking game. Tim, Garnet, and Dirk are all thinkers with hi BB IQs i don't think Amare has shown that yet. He hasn't had to lead his team since he had Marbury and Nash so its unfair to measure his leadership but you can look at his game and easily see that its based on athlesticism. Lets see how he matures before we label him a great one.

No doubt about it though, he will be the premier PF as tim/garnett/dirk/ start to show their age. he already lit up Tim in the playoffs (i know stopping amare wasn't our defensive focus).
I think you guys are underrating his ability to put up big numbers. I am not saying the scoring is all that matters in BB. Of course you need high BB IQ. I don't know if I can agree with you that he doesn't. From what I see he does. And I remember Hubie (I think) was saying "People say he scores b/c he is open. Yes, he is open b/c he reads the defense". I agree with him. He has done it to top defender like Tim throughout the season, whether he was injured or not.

Also if you can do it against top defensive team like Spurs who can rotate very well and force the other player to the uncomfortaboe position to score. Of course he is blessed with his atheleticism. But in addition to the quickness on foot, he changes the direction of the ball going in to the basket on the air that players have a hard time to block his shot. It is not like he just go flat directly to dunk every one. Dunking is hard enough to block with his quickness and strength. But he also often time softens the shot with ZZZ ball handling on the air, as far as I can see.

What impressed me most was his outside jumper. We all saw it. Let's admit. I think that compares to the improvement of D Wade who made a huge leap on his jump shots from a year ago. He deserves a lot of credit for that commitment working on shots.

Yes, he needs a lot of work on defense. But with his instict, he should be able to do it. He has done it to Tim. He was watching Manu for driving lay ups with Tim behind at that game 4. As soon as Manu passed the ball to Tim, Tim was so close to the basket that he didn't have to go for a jump hook shot or something like that except dunk. Amare got up and got up to that ball so fast, even slow motion didn't seem to take a second.

He just needs to learn some defensive position and some tactics for defense here and there. What makes you think he can't learn. He is younger than Tony. He is already mentioned by many to become a future MVP for sure. With his ability and with his attitude so far, I should say he can be just that and the status of Tim of coure too (if not better).

And I think people are forgetting that Suns was at the top of WCF during regular season. The important thing is that they were not even close to that a year ago. Of course there were a lot of factors. But on the paper, were they better than Spurs, Nuggets, Minnesota, Mavs, Rockets or even Utah? I should say no.

Amare is just too young right now to be regarded as dominant as Tim or KG or so people thought. And Nash just came in for this season. With Marion helping inside and with a couple of good shooters, they went all the way to be a top contender in WCF with no significant experience beforehand.

And Amare was so consistent throughout, better than Tim. Better FT shooter as well.

Whether Amare is a KG type of player or not, I am not sure. So far, KG has been a more perimeter type kind of player or so I heard. Amare forces inside a lot more than KG and forces a lot of fouls as well.

I guess Amare was not a national sensation from Day one like LeBron. But for the big men, I heard, it is a lot harder and takes longer with all the footworks and defenses and so on. IMO he certainly has develped a lot faster with a steep slope than you could hope for. Of course, he has Nash to thank for as well.

Can Amare win some titles? Why not? They went to WCF already. Although it won't be easy past the Spurs, generally you have to like their organization for moving into the right direction and making the right moves for the way they did so far with Amare and Nash.

So, I am very anxious to see them this season with new look. I don't know how they are going to do. If they can get to WCF again, whether they get past Spurs or not (suppose Spurs get there, or hope), I should say several knocks on doors seem to suggest they can do it one day.

As far as Amare's game is concerned, I don't know if he should go for 3s. That is more like Dirk's game. Maybe he has a really good touch with ball. At least his jumper is good. So, if he can, he can. However, I think he should work on his defense and his passing a lot more than working on 3s. And I don't think I saw post moves from him like Tim or Rasheed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris FOM
Amare is good no doubt, even amazing, but his performance in the WCF had more to do with the Spurs defensive schemes than just pure talent and skill on his part.
He has done it against ALL TEAMS.
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  #50  
Old 10-05-05, 05:49 PM
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Man that was a long post. So we all agree that he plays little or no d at all but is a good shot blocker. We also agree that his jumper is ugly but somehow falls. We also agree that he probably would've learned to play d in college. So bottom line for me, suns fans should wait a few more years before saying he is a legend in the making.
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