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  #1  
Old 08-05-05, 03:27 PM
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Should Horry and Miller be in the Hall of Fame???

I no this has been asked over and over again. But i was wondering does Reggie Miller and Robert Horry go in the Hall of Fame?

I think they both should be but i would pick Miller to be in the Hall of Fame over Hoory any day. Miller had done more then Horry. I no Horry's career isnt over, but i dont think he is going to accomplished what Miller did. The only thing with Miller is he never won a ring. He has been to the Finals though. Miller and Horry are probly the best clutch players ever to play. I think they both should. But I know Reggie will be in the Hall of Fame but i dont no bout Robert Horry.

What do u think?
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  #2  
Old 08-05-05, 03:37 PM
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RM - Yes
RH - Maybe (Depends on what the voters look at Rings & Contribution or just pure stats)
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  #3  
Old 08-05-05, 03:40 PM
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reggie miller yes. robert horry no.
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  #4  
Old 08-05-05, 03:52 PM
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Miller is a yes in my book, though a lot of people say no.

Emotionally I'd like Horry, but technically he hasn't accomplished what other HOFers have. Of course, the HOF has a pretty blah entry in there already. Then again, he does have the most made playoff threes. Who knows.
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  #5  
Old 08-05-05, 04:04 PM
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Here we go again.

I know it's the offseason, but jeez.

Reggie Miller is unquestionably a HOF player. Whether or not he's a first ballot HOF (meaning he is a lock on his first year of eligibility) is another question.

Miller's career numbers are certainly HOF worthy as well as some of his accomplishments (5 Time All Star, Olympian, 3 Time All NBA, 15th on the All Time Scoring List. Considering his career almost defines a single franchise (Indiana) and he made them a perrenial playoff team for over a decade - I would say yes. Everyone always knew where the ball was going to go in crunch time - but yet stopping him was another question entirely.

Horry is one of the most clutch players in NBA history. But he is a career role player that was often not even the third offensive option on his team, much less the first. he never had to carry a franchise as so many HOF players did and his career numbers and accomplishments are extremely modest. He admits to loafing through seasons until the playoffs.

To make a quick comparrison: In 13 seasons, Horry has just over 7,000 career points. In the same time span - Miller had nearly 20,000 points.

You have to consider a players entire career - not just the moments we choose to recall. Miller got it done 82 games a year PLUS the post season. Horry loafed through the season and finally showed up at critical moments.

I know some of us may want to consider Horry now that he's a Spur - but the truth is: he's never belonged there.The HOF is for the elite players in NBA history - Horry doesn't qualify.
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  #6  
Old 08-05-05, 04:05 PM
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Reggie Miller is a definate YES. And when Robert Horry decides to retire like Reggie I am sure he will go down on the list. Right now it is kinda hard to throw him in there when he has just signed a new contract with our Spurs. When his time comes make sure you have a HUGE bucket of popcorn and a few snacks because the HIGHLIGHTS they will show will have you sitting for a while. THANKS BIG SHOT ROB!!! And the very best of luck to Reggie Miller!
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  #7  
Old 08-05-05, 04:06 PM
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I agree with the sentiment that Reggie is a YES and that Horry is borderline.

But until 'Nique gets elected, I even have doubts about Reggie.
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  #8  
Old 08-05-05, 04:21 PM
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Miller: Yes; no question.

Horry: No.
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  #9  
Old 08-05-05, 04:29 PM
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Miller of course. When anyone who knows basketball thinks of the 3 pointer we think of Bird and Miller. his stats rank up there with the best all-time shooters in history and he is clutch in ALL playoff situations. Unfortuentaly for him he never had the chance to play with Hakeem, Snaq or Duncan.

Horry no. Even though the basketball HoF is by far the easiest to get into, Horry still does not deserve it. I can't think of a single role-player, in any sport, that is in the HoF. Although he is the single biggest playoff clutch player in history, he never would have been able to prove that without 3 of the greatest big men to ever play.
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  #10  
Old 08-05-05, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
I know some of us may want to consider Horry now that he's a Spur - but the truth is: he's never belonged there.The HOF is for the elite players in NBA history - Horry doesn't qualify.
I thought the HOF was the Hall of Fame of Basketball, not just the NBA elite players. Correct me if i'm wrong.
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  #11  
Old 08-05-05, 04:38 PM
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There's not any question about Reggie Miller.
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  #12  
Old 08-05-05, 04:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bonnington
I thought the HOF was the Hall of Fame of Basketball, not just the NBA elite players. Correct me if i'm wrong.
You're right - it is a basketball HOF. But we are talking about NBA basketball players in this particular case. Whether you played in college, internationally or professionally - only the most elite players belong.

Horry had neither a standout career at Alabama, he never competed internationally and he was a role player with very modest numbers in the NBA.

I don't see how he gets in at all or is even considered.
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  #13  
Old 08-05-05, 04:57 PM
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He shouldnt be considered...and he'd be the first to tell you that.

Reggie should get the knod...and me thinks he should return for one more year....they have a great shot in the East with the additions they've made
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  #14  
Old 08-05-05, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
You're right - it is a basketball HOF. But we are talking about NBA basketball players in this particular case. Whether you played in college, internationally or professionally - only the most elite players belong.

Horry had neither a standout career at Alabama, he never competed internationally and he was a role player with very modest numbers in the NBA.

I don't see how he gets in at all or is even considered.
Honestly i don't know too much about the HOF and I don't know if Horry will belong there or not. My question was just to clarify the point of the HOF is a Basketball Hall of Fame and not just NBA. Thank you for your answer Rich.
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  #15  
Old 08-05-05, 06:25 PM
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Rich did remind me that literally, when we consider Rob it's only for one thing really, playoff clutchness. But overall he's not a standout player season by season.
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  #16  
Old 08-05-05, 07:15 PM
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i dont know.....horry made a lot of big shots.
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  #17  
Old 08-05-05, 07:22 PM
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If Lynn Swan can be in the Pro Football Hall based on his Super Bowl performances (because he did not have Hall of Fame career numbers), then Horry deserves to be in!
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  #18  
Old 08-05-05, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTD
If Lynn Swan can be in the Pro Football Hall based on his Super Bowl performances (because he did not have Hall of Fame career numbers), then Horry deserves to be in!
Swan had good (not great) career numbers and was an All Pro Wide Receiver.

He wasn't Jerry Rice by any stretch, but it wasn't like he was Freddie Mitchell either!

Horry has not even had a Lynn Swan type career. Where are the points? The rebounds? The All Star appearences, the All NBA Selections?

He has none of that.

For all his supposed 3 point prowess - look at where he ranks in NBA history:

Career 3PFG - 81st in NBA History
Career 3PFG Attempts - 74th in NBA History

Maybe it's his defense?

Career Steals - 97th in NBA History
Career Blocks - 77th in NBA History


As I said - you have to view a players complete career and look at it in perspective. If you do that - you will see that Horry was a modest NBA player for the majority of his career, who played big in some critical playoff games.

Horry played in over a thousand regular season and playoff games combined. He did absolutely nothing to stand out for those regular seasons - as well as in some of those post seasons.

How can you reward a player who only played exceptionally well or showed up for less than 10% of the games he actually played in??

Think about it folks.
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  #19  
Old 08-05-05, 09:23 PM
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reggie-yes he is the best clutch shooter of all time and is the best in 3 pointers
robert-yes he has had the most 3's in the playoffs and is one of the best clutch shooters
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  #20  
Old 08-05-05, 09:37 PM
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yes to both

As it is a hall of fame- Reggie and Big Shot Rob are famous for being clutch performers, especially during the playfoffs
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  #21  
Old 08-05-05, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbagurl731
robert-yes he has had the most 3's in the playoffs and is one of the best clutch shooters
What part of my above post do you not understand or comprehend?

Horry is a player who played exceptionally well for less than 10% of the games he played in. That is NOT Hall of Fame material.

How would you feel if a guy that works with you was given a substantial raise or made Manager or whatever, and you actually knew that he only busted his butt when the bosses were around and worked hard less than 10% of the time he was on the clock.

How would you feel if you were overlooked by your bosses for such a position when you busted your azz 100% every day, 5 days a week - and it went to some loafer that only worked hard when it was convienient for him and when he knew the bosses would be watching?

Not very good, I'm assuming.

I like Robert Horry. I respect Robert Horry and his contributions to this team and throughout his career.

But he did not have a Hall of Fame career by any stretch of the imagination. Having the record fopr the most 3 pointers in the playoffs doesn't change that fact.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Samurai
yes to both

As it is a hall of fame- Reggie and Big Shot Rob are famous for being clutch performers, especially during the playfoffs
You have GOT to be f@#king KIDDING ME????????????????????

Why not put each and every famous player in the HOF?? It is about FAME after all, right????



You people never cease to amaze me.
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  #22  
Old 08-05-05, 10:53 PM
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First off, Rich, chill out.

Also, since when does everything always make sense?

If Horry continues to make big plays in the playoffs and in the process win 2 more rings, then I wouldn't be shocked if Horry gets in the HOF.

As a point of reference look at the numbers for K.C. Jones. He was voted into the HOF as a player. Obviously, his coaching credentials had to have helped, but point is: it isn't as if role players haven't got in before.



K.C. Jones

G FG% FT% Rebs RPG Asts APG Pts PPG
676 .387 .647 2,399 3.5 2,908 4.3 5,011 7.4


Robert Horry

YEAR TEAM G GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
Career 931 464 26.0 .431 .343 .737 1.6 3.5 5.0 2.3 1.13 .90 1.37 2.60 7.5
Playoff 198 111 30.7 .432 .363 .718 1.8 4.3 6.1 2.7 1.29 .94 1.29 3.10 9.0

P.S. Horry's numbers in the regular season are remarkably similar to his playoff numbers. These stats don't support that assertion that he loafs in the regular season or only plays hard for 10% of his games.

Last edited by Jones; 08-05-05 at 11:56 PM.
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  #23  
Old 08-05-05, 11:27 PM
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K C Jones is a HOFer, then Horry should as well.

Miller will get in. The Hall of Fame for all the different sports is incremently becoming a marketing mechanism with each passing year anyway. Go with the flow.
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  #24  
Old 08-06-05, 01:41 AM
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Even if Horry wins two more championships he will still be borderline,but its not impossible.
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  #25  
Old 08-06-05, 01:52 AM
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HORRY & MILLER BOTH DESERVE TO BE IN THE HOF

I DONT UNDERSTAND WHY SOME OF YOU IN THIS THREAD SAID THAT R. HORRY DOES NOT QUALIFIED TO BE IN THE (H.O.F.).

HE DOES ALOT OF THINGS ON THE COURT, COMES UP BIG, WHEN YOU NEED HIM IN
THE GAME, I BET ALOT OF YOU WERE NOT SAYING THIS WHEN HE CARRYED US IN
GAME 5 OF THE NBA FINALS.

THE MAN HAS 6 - RINGS, WITH 3 DIFFERENT TEAMS, AND HAS PLAYED BESIDE 3 DIFFERENT BIG GUYS, (THE DREAM, SHAQ, OF COURSE THE BEST "TIM DUNCAN"),

ROBERT HORRY DESERVES TO BE IN THE H.O.F. NO DOUBT ABOUT IT.

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  #26  
Old 08-06-05, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1SPURSFAN21209
I DONT UNDERSTAND WHY SOME OF YOU IN THIS THREAD SAID THAT R. HORRY DOES NOT QUALIFIED TO BE IN THE (H.O.F.).

HE DOES ALOT OF THINGS ON THE COURT, COMES UP BIG, WHEN YOU NEED HIM IN
THE GAME, I BET ALOT OF YOU WERE NOT SAYING THIS WHEN HE CARRYED US IN
GAME 5 OF THE NBA FINALS.

THE MAN HAS 6 - RINGS, WITH 3 DIFFERENT TEAMS, AND HAS PLAYED BESIDE 3 DIFFERENT BIG GUYS, (THE DREAM, SHAQ, OF COURSE THE BEST "TIM DUNCAN"),

ROBERT HORRY DESERVES TO BE IN THE H.O.F. NO DOUBT ABOUT IT.

#1SPURSFAN21209
Why are you yelling? this topic upset you? chill out. You are using capital letters that equals to shouting.
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  #27  
Old 08-06-05, 09:51 AM
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Miller is a HOF, he holds two regular season and playoffs 3PT FG made records, had made a lot of points during his carrer, has been all-star five times, he was the guy to go of a playoffs team, and he is considered one of the most clutch players of all time. Besides he's an 1996 Olympic champion too, he played more games for the same franchise than any player except Malone and Stockton for the Jazz. He goes HOF with his first nomination.

Horry has sunk MANY different Rockets, Lakers and Spurs opponents during the playoffs. With highest level one on one defense, timely rebounds and blocks, legendary threes in the clutch. He holds the record for most 3PT FG made in finals. Also, he ranks second all time, in three points made in playoffs, behind Reggie Miller. Horry ranks third all time in playoffs games, behind Pippen and Kareem. As of now he goes in, but will require two or three nominations.

Horry hasnt retired yet, so he could go down with one or two more rings, and the most 3PT FG in playoffs and most playoffs games played records, in which case he will be a lock too for the HOF.

Last edited by dunkman; 08-06-05 at 09:57 AM.
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  #28  
Old 08-06-05, 10:00 AM
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I think so, Miller is a shoo-in as far as I'm concerned, and Horry should be also, but his reg. season stats, may hold him back, but if I had a vote, hell yes.
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  #29  
Old 08-06-05, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
How many times did he score 30 points in a playoff game? How about 25?

The Hall of Fame should be reserved for the best of the best for 48 minutes a game in both the regular season and the playoffs.

The question you should ask is, 'if this player were on the Clippers, would his success still be relatively the same?'
One could ask too, if the Spurs would have won this year with another player instead of him. And the same goes for the Lakers or the Rockets.
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  #30  
Old 08-06-05, 11:14 AM
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Yes to Horry.
Although he may not be the strongest of candidates, he is still worthy.

You don't have to be an All-Star to get into the HOF. You don't have to be #1 this, Top 10 that.

Has Horry made a significant contribution in the NBA? Has Horry left his mark in the NBA? Is Horry's career a significant chapter in the historical development of the game of basketball?

Has Horry not raised the bar of what a role player can be? Has Horry not set the bar as to what a clutch playoff performer should be?

You can ask what would of happened if Isaiah Thomas went to the Clips?

What if James Worthy went to the Clips?

HOF's are judged on what they did, with who they ended up with.
Not some "coulda, might of" scenarios.
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  #31  
Old 08-06-05, 11:44 AM
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Sorry, but Lynn Swan does not deserve to be in the Hall over players like Drew Pearson or Art Monk. Swan did not have a hall of fame career and if the Steelers had only won 2 SB's instead of 4, he would not be in. I was mearly comparing that fact that if he could be voted in on his superbowl catches then why not Horry on his clutch 3's!!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB
Swan had good (not great) career numbers and was an All Pro Wide Receiver.

He wasn't Jerry Rice by any stretch, but it wasn't like he was Freddie Mitchell either!

Horry has not even had a Lynn Swan type career. Where are the points? The rebounds? The All Star appearences, the All NBA Selections?

He has none of that.

For all his supposed 3 point prowess - look at where he ranks in NBA history:

Career 3PFG - 81st in NBA History
Career 3PFG Attempts - 74th in NBA History

Maybe it's his defense?

Career Steals - 97th in NBA History
Career Blocks - 77th in NBA History


As I said - you have to view a players complete career and look at it in perspective. If you do that - you will see that Horry was a modest NBA player for the majority of his career, who played big in some critical playoff games.

Horry played in over a thousand regular season and playoff games combined. He did absolutely nothing to stand out for those regular seasons - as well as in some of those post seasons.

How can you reward a player who only played exceptionally well or showed up for less than 10% of the games he actually played in??

Think about it folks.
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  #32  
Old 08-06-05, 12:54 PM
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KC started for 3 Boston championship teams. He was a reserve for the other 5 rings he won. But it is very clear that he was a role player. The stars of the team earlier on were Cousy and Russell, and later on Sam Jones, Havlicek and Russell.

Role players CAN enter the HOF. Is Horry worthy? Quite possibly.
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  #33  
Old 08-06-05, 01:01 PM
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Reggie? will be in.
Horry? probably no.
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  #34  
Old 08-06-05, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
You don't? That's news to me. Name one non-allstar in the Hall of Fame.
You already wrote about him yourself. KC Jones!
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  #35  
Old 08-06-05, 01:19 PM
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Jones isn't the only one. The original sixth man, Frank Ramsey, also was never an All-Star, and he's in the HOF. That means that extraordinary role players that contribute and win big have a chance to get into the HOF. The precedent has been set.

No worries about "lowering the bar". After all, guys like Horry don't come around very often, do they? John Sally is no Horry, that's for sure.
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  #36  
Old 08-06-05, 01:22 PM
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pre-empted you!
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  #37  
Old 08-06-05, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
You don't? That's news to me. Name one non-allstar in the Hall of Fame.
.
Easy........K.C. Jones or Drazen Petrovic.

Also.....ANY player that played before there even was an NBA all star game, which were't around until the 50's.

Lynette Woodard never played in an NBA All star game......she never even played in the WNBA all star game.

And there is a long list of foreign players and Harlem Globetrotters that never played in the NBA all star game.

Participation in an NBA all star game is not criteria to get
into the HOF. But odds are, if you are good enough to be considered for the HOF.....you played in a few all star games along the way.
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  #38  
Old 08-06-05, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
Another Celtic on those championship teams.....more east coast bias.
Well then if Horry makes it too, there won't be any more East Coast bias, would there?
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  #39  
Old 08-06-05, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
ohhh, KC Jones....I forgot.....
You asked me to name one HOF'r that never played in an AS game.

I named TWO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
Horry played in the All Star Era
Horry's not a woman.
And?

You are saying a player must be an NBA AS to be inducted.
Dozens and dozens of players are in the HOF, who never played in the NBA AS game.
If AS game appearances were required, how do you explain that?
How about Drazen? How about Woodard?
How do you explain that?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
Horry has done nothing on the international scene and was never a Trotter.
Again....If AS game appearances were required, how do you these players getting in the HOF?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
At least KC Jones was the QB so to speak and a defensive specialist for 3 of his 9 rings.
Sounds like a role player huh?
I thought role players, and players with no AS appearances were not good enough for the HOF?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
It's a travesty that guys like these are in and guys like Artis Gilmore are still out.
Agreed.
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  #40  
Old 08-06-05, 10:19 PM
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Hey Robert's Career isn't over yet maybe he will do something great before he retires.
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  #41  
Old 08-06-05, 10:24 PM
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Everyone beat me to it, but yes to Reggie. I wouldn't call him a complete player or superstar, but you still had to gameplan against him. If he had a shot at it, he was going to beat you.

Horry, no.

AFAIK, Artis Gilmore is not in the Hall. He should be.
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  #42  
Old 08-06-05, 10:57 PM
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To echo what others have already said - Reggie should be in, Horry shouldn't. Reggie was the personification of a team and a playing style, who was in starting shape until he was 39. Horry does have the rings, but he's a roleplayer and not a star, much less a franchise player.
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  #43  
Old 08-06-05, 10:59 PM
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Reggie is probably a HOF but Horry is not even close.
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  #44  
Old 08-06-05, 11:40 PM
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Yo Blake......
Ummm....re-reading my post to you......it retrospect it seems real confrontational, sort of in a "I am right, and you are an idiot" way, which wasn't intended. I hope you didn't take it that way, bud.

I think when it is all said and done, Horry won't get in.
If he gets in, I'll be happy for him.
If he doesn't, I won't shed a tear.

What is ironic to me is the man has 6 rings......but I don't think any team will retire his number.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nbagurl731
Hey Robert's Career isn't over yet maybe he will do something great before he retires.
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