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tenthousandaces 12-26-13 08:49 AM

Trade ideas...
 
I don't think it's too early or too unreasonable to say that this Spurs team can't win the league championship with the current roster. Not with Houston, OKC and Miami/Indy being so good, not only as teams but also as collections of exceptional individual talent that are able to dominate their respective matchups.

So... If we're going to compete for a ring this year, we'll have consolidate resources to trade for a significant player at one of our weaker positions. With that being said, it may be debated what positions those are, and of course all depends on who is available out there and what other teams' needs are.

What do you all think? There are certainly some talented players out there who could help us, and there are always going to be teams willing to deal, for various reasons. What trade scenarios could make sense for the Spurs, for now and for the future?

Spurd_On 12-26-13 11:45 AM

I think you answered your own question by saying that these teams "have collections of exceptional individual talent that are able to dominate their respective matchups." Therefore, the Spurs have nothing of value to trade. Up until now, the Spurs have been able to take average players and fit them into an exceptional system and get by. Now more than a handful of teams are equipped with exceptional players in exceptional systems.

SilverSpur 12-26-13 12:01 PM

I'll play... But the first question is, what position do we need to fill that is "weak?"

tenthousandaces 12-26-13 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurd_On (Post 1306619)
I think you answered your own question by saying that these teams "have collections of exceptional individual talent that are able to dominate their respective matchups." Therefore, the Spurs have nothing of value to trade. Up until now, the Spurs have been able to take average players and fit them into an exceptional system and get by. Now more than a handful of teams are equipped with exceptional players in exceptional systems.

No sir! In fact, the Spurs do have value to trade, by bundling roster players, rights to overseas players, and future draft picks, which would appeal to a trade partner that is not competing for a title this year (and especially if the trade partner is looking to avoid luxury tax).

Spurd_On 12-26-13 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverSpur (Post 1306620)
I'll play... But the first question is, what position do we need to fill that is "weak?"

Backup Small forward and Stretch 4. That would spread the oppositions defense and slow down the opposition's perimeter shooting and open lanes, at least in theory.

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Spurd_On 12-26-13 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tenthousandaces (Post 1306621)
No sir! In fact, the Spurs do have value to trade, by bundling roster players, rights to overseas players, and future draft picks, which would appeal to a trade partner that is not competing for a title this year (and especially if the trade partner is looking to avoid luxury tax).

My opinion is that the Spurs over seas prospects and future draft picks is all that the Spurs have to hold onto for the future and they will not be letting them go. As to bundles, what do the Spurs have to bundle? Bonner's expiring contract and a couple of 3rd string point guards?
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tenthousandaces 12-26-13 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverSpur (Post 1306620)
I'll play... But the first question is, what position do we need to fill that is "weak?"

Granted, "weak" is a strong word, so I'll say that in order to contend, we would need to upgrade at one of the following positions: shooting guard, small forward or center. We don't have a dominant player at any of these positions any more. Kawhi, Manu, Danny and Tiago are all solid if not above average players, but none are elite, nor will they be at any time this year.

exit7 12-26-13 12:35 PM

Through 29 games our record is 22-7, good enough for first place in our division and 3rd in the west. The last 8 seasons our average record at this point is 21-8. You win the games your supposed to, and get to the playoffs with one of the top seeds, then who knows what will happen.

This team is getting older (obviously) but there isn't a trade that is going to make the spurs drastically better. If there was, they would have pulled the trigger already. I do think it is too early, and definitely unreasonable, to say that this team can't compete for a championship. Six months ago, they were a free throw away...

frenchfred 12-26-13 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exit7 (Post 1306628)
Through 29 games our record is 22-7, good enough for first place in our division and 3rd in the west. The last 8 seasons our average record at this point is 21-8. You win the games your supposed to, and get to the playoffs with one of the top seeds, then who knows what will happen.

This team is getting older (obviously) but there isn't a trade that is going to make the spurs drastically better. If there was, they would have pulled the trigger already. I do think it is too early, and definitely unreasonable, to say that this team can't compete for a championship. Six months ago, they were a free throw away...

It is too early but still this year we notice that the Spurs are not beating the top teams at all, we have lost all the games against them and those will be the teams that we'll need to beat in the playoffs.

Spurd_On 12-26-13 05:00 PM

It may be too early to have solved the dilemma but its not too early to see the patterns forming. More than a third of the season is behind them.

rooster 12-26-13 07:35 PM

Not that this trade will happen, But how bout danny green and matt bonner for jeff green from boston.

thesuspence281 12-26-13 10:20 PM

The crazy thing to me is that we have a roster who should be better than it was last year. The only difference is that all of our guys are a bit older. I guess everyone else has just gotten so much better since last year and we have gotten older and seemingly slower. I don't know if a trade can improve us that much when its been our starters who have been outplayed (maybe just outscored if not outplayed) in recent losses.

SilverSpur 12-27-13 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tenthousandaces (Post 1306627)
Granted, "weak" is a strong word, so I'll say that in order to contend, we would need to upgrade at one of the following positions: shooting guard, small forward or center. We don't have a dominant player at any of these positions any more. Kawhi, Manu, Danny and Tiago are all solid if not above average players, but none are elite, nor will they be at any time this year.

I like this analysis and point of view. It makes the most sense, especially when I have seen players in these positions (like Borris Diaw) step it up and start to dominate during a particular game.

Spurs don't like to make trades. Time and again we'veseen this.

As such, I think it may be a very deep long shot to think that we will make something happen before the trade deadline.

Uwe Blab 12-27-13 10:51 AM

Parker is the only legitimate star on the team at this point. Manu is playing extremely well, but that won't last a whole season and he still makes his usual late game TOs. Tim plays well at times, but gets outmatched at times. So, teams can keep Parker out of the paint and make others beat them. If no one else is ready to play, it spells doom for the Spurs.

I can say this, Houston is beatable, the Spurs obviously weren't into the game on Xmas. OKC is the team that is scary. And if Portland doesn't give in to inexperience, that is a scary team. Indiana is another team like that.

I guess my point is that the Spurs need another consistent offensive star. I was hoping KY would have filled that role this year, but so far has not, but he is their best defender. Unfortunately, that doesn't equate to wins in this league. But it's still pretty early. The problem is that the Spurs aren't exactly a lock for top 4 seeding.

tenthousandaces 12-27-13 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1306653)
Parker is the only legitimate star on the team at this point. Manu is playing extremely well, but that won't last a whole season and he still makes his usual late game TOs. Tim plays well at times, but gets outmatched at times. So, teams can keep Parker out of the paint and make others beat them. If no one else is ready to play, it spells doom for the Spurs.

I can say this, Houston is beatable, the Spurs obviously weren't into the game on Xmas. OKC is the team that is scary. And if Portland doesn't give in to inexperience, that is a scary team. Indiana is another team like that.

I guess my point is that the Spurs need another consistent offensive star. I was hoping KY would have filled that role this year, but so far has not, but he is their best defender. Unfortunately, that doesn't equate to wins in this league. But it's still pretty early. The problem is that the Spurs aren't exactly a lock for top 4 seeding.

Yes, exactly!

grizzly_bexar 12-28-13 12:53 AM

I'd like us to be a better team, sure, but how can you say this team can't win a title since we were a missed free throw from winning one last year?

This roster is not playing nearly the defense that last year's did, but not because we don't have the horses. Belinelli is better than Neal. Mills is playing better than Neal/Joseph last year. Manu is healthy. Our defensive intensity is just not there, particularly against elite teams. That's what needs to change, not roster composition. Though if we can upgrade, sure. But not because we can't win as currently outfitted.

tenthousandaces 12-28-13 02:48 AM

There seems to be agreement that our speed and physicality has declined this year on the defensive end, and this is also apparent in the stats. While Manu and Tim are only 6 months removed from last year's finals, they also happen to be in an age range where loss of muscle mass becomes noticeable (not huge, mind you, but certainly noticeable). In a league where fractions of a second and explosiveness make all the difference, one must wonder about our chances this year. Exactly which 5 guys do we want to have on the court in crunch time?? We have a lot of specialists, but few all-around studs. And the all-around studs that we do have, are not what they used to be, and more and more often are overmatched. But hey, I do love our underdog Spurs!!

Guille 12-28-13 10:47 AM

I donīt see a trade coming.
Even more so, I see Pop giving too many minutes to Ayres trying to make him comfortable in our system to be dependable when it matters most, but we do have Bonner as a stretch four and he will be ready when Pop calls his number, which will probably start happening more and more often after ASG break. Danny Green will be back to starting lineup as Manu and Belinelli together are great.
This is the roster we are going to battle with for the title. We are one of the top five teams and in the playoffs anything can happen. I still like our chances. We can be anywhere from second round to champions, as all contenders in the west are. In the East we are heading towards another Indy-Miami Finals, but then anything can happen too.

crazytlingit 12-28-13 01:46 PM

I do think we need to unload some of our point guards and possibly Matt Bonner, only because someone might take him to cut salary. But that only gets us a small or power forward that might be average. But we need to thin out our roster, because if we win it will not be because we have 4 point guards on our team, in which only two of them will actually get playing time. Corey Joseph just doesn't have the handles to play a fast game and Nando is too slow. I keep Patty and deal the other two.

But we will not make a move and we have no real trade bait to get a star player of any sorts, so that should be the last thing we should ever even think about.

I will say we are a Kawhi/Marco/Danny break out of slump away from the spurs being a great team. Marco is doing fine, but Kawhi and Danny are a complete disappointment. Kawhi is not all-star material from what I've seen, he will be a exceptional player that gets the job done. Danny can't dribble and if his shot isn't falling he becomes useless on the offensive end.

Uwe Blab 12-28-13 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grizzly_bexar (Post 1306664)
I'd like us to be a better team, sure, but how can you say this team can't win a title since we were a missed free throw from winning one last year?

This roster is not playing nearly the defense that last year's did, but not because we don't have the horses. Belinelli is better than Neal. Mills is playing better than Neal/Joseph last year. Manu is healthy. Our defensive intensity is just not there, particularly against elite teams. That's what needs to change, not roster composition. Though if we can upgrade, sure. But not because we can't win as currently outfitted.

There are 3 maybe 4 teams that are just better than the Spurs. Last year the Spurs were the recipient of some luck (Westbrook out) and some hot shooting at the perfect time (Green and Neal). If all teams were healthy at the end, I don't think the Spurs have enough. But maybe, just maybe, the Spurs will have some luck again this year.


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