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WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 01:20 AM

Bonner playoff history debate
 
Okay years of Spurs playoff exits with Bonner not playing well was blamed on the Big 3 not playing like the Big 3 and that's the only reason why he sucked so bad right? Well tonight the Big 3 had 12 by TD, 7 by Manu, 6 by TP in points. But somehow Green and Neal go off big time points wise and stat wise. So why before when Bonner sucked in the playoffs it was the Big 3s fault on Bonner's suck play? Yes Green starts but Neal doesn't. Both guys were end of the draft to being undrafted players. They are role players. Bonner is a role player. So why didn't he perform in years past? I thought the reasons on the Big 3 were bull. They still are. GO SPURS GO TRADE BONNER!:applause

Jose_TheGenius 06-12-13 06:22 AM

you're being too simplistic when it comes to the game of basketball with this assessment.

Manu's points are different from Parker's.

TP had a low amount of points, but the entire Heat defense was focused on him. Ginobili wasn't the focus of the Heat defense and didn't do well.

when you take that into account, TP didn't really have "a bad game" while Manu didn't have a "good game". the ball movement from double teams that Parker would face help confirm that while Ginobili didn't have that same scheme.

now Bonner. yeah he sucked, but he only played 12 minutes anyway in a game that was meaningless for the majority of those minutes. in other words, Bonner's play really didn't matter anyway. that's like arguing why Patty Mills sucked in garbage time.

Bonner is one of the last guys in the rotation in this series unlike when he was a huge factor in the LA Lakers series (mainly because of LeBron at the 4), so your Bonner hating fetish has no basis this series. if you want to get on someone, get on Ginobili who hasn't shown up at all these playoffs. he's part of the Big 3, Bonner is just a role player.

TimmyDthaWay2B 06-12-13 07:38 AM

There is no complex answer..
Bonner isn't good. Its as simple as that... All he can do is shoot three's, and he doesn' even do that unless it's the regular season... He sucks... But i like him off the court.

pjm 06-12-13 10:01 AM

Jose, I think you missed the point here.

From what I understand the argument here is comparing Green and Neal's game from this game from past playoff experiences (Will is probably referring to 2008-2012) from Bonner.
Green and Neal could have big games and a big impact in the game despite the "Big 3" being subpar last game. Then the question is why wasn't Bonner able to do that between 2008 and 2012 playoffs?

WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius (Post 1299080)
you're being too simplistic when it comes to the game of basketball with this assessment.

Manu's points are different from Parker's.

TP had a low amount of points, but the entire Heat defense was focused on him. Ginobili wasn't the focus of the Heat defense and didn't do well.

when you take that into account, TP didn't really have "a bad game" while Manu didn't have a "good game". the ball movement from double teams that Parker would face help confirm that while Ginobili didn't have that same scheme.

now Bonner. yeah he sucked, but he only played 12 minutes anyway in a game that was meaningless for the majority of those minutes. in other words, Bonner's play really didn't matter anyway. that's like arguing why Patty Mills sucked in garbage time.

Bonner is one of the last guys in the rotation in this series unlike when he was a huge factor in the LA Lakers series (mainly because of LeBron at the 4), so your Bonner hating fetish has no basis this series. if you want to get on someone, get on Ginobili who hasn't shown up at all these playoffs. he's part of the Big 3, Bonner is just a role player.

It went way over your head even though I made it very simple for anyone to understand. I wasn't talking about last night. It really had nothing to do with Bonner's game last night. I was talking about Bonner the previous Bonner playoff years when he had all the chances in the world. Neal is just a role player and so is Bonner. Why are you a Bonner defender now? Is it because it's coming from me? lol. The Big 3 didn't suck but they didn't have the "Big 3" type of game last night. Role players stepped up scoring wise. You still have to score more points than the other team to win. Bonner didn't step up the previous years. The Big 3 is really not the big three of the past and you pointed it out with Manu so thanks for doing that. It highlighted my point even more because this playoff run others have stepped up on a less powerful Big 3. Bottom line Bonner sucked in the past and sucks now. That was my point. Guess you became a Bonner lover around the All Star break.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjm (Post 1299100)
Jose, I think you missed the point here.

From what I understand the argument here is comparing Green and Neal's game from this game from past playoff experiences (Will is probably referring to 2008-2012) from Bonner.
Green and Neal could have big games and a big impact in the game despite the "Big 3" being subpar last game. Then the question is why wasn't Bonner able to do that between 2008 and 2012 playoffs?


Jose G did miss it...........AGAIN!

Jose is very smart and knows a lot about basketball(sometimes). But since I typed it........He has a knack of replying to what he wants to read or understand and not the whole picture of my point or points. He says I have a hate fetish for Bonner. Not really just being honest .....to be honest. I hated Rasho and they traded him to get Bonner which was an awesome move in 2006. Only thing was he got paid more and more to be an Horry replacement(slot wise) and has crumbled in the playoffs when the lights came on. Last night was not the only night a role player or two has stepped up Big 3 playing awesome or not. Thanks and I'm looking forward to someone answering that last question you have.

Uwe Blab 06-12-13 12:56 PM

Bonner did stink last night in garbage time. But here's why Green and Neal had such a great night. Tony was facilitating the offense and drawing defenses to him, leaving them wide open. Green and Neal also had some crazy shots that went in. It was a perfect storm of shooting. That did not happen in the Memphis series two years ago or in the OKC series last year. Now, will they shoot like that again in this series? Probably not. It's just one game, and not a good sample to bring up the topic again.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1299119)
Bonner did stink last night in garbage time. But here's why Green and Neal had such a great night. Tony was facilitating the offense and drawing defenses to him, leaving them wide open. Green and Neal also had some crazy shots that went in. It was a perfect storm of shooting. That did not happen in the Memphis series two years ago or in the OKC series last year. Now, will they shoot like that again in this series? Probably not. It's just one game, and not a good sample to bring up the topic again.

It's not just one game I'm talking about but an obvious example for last night. I mean is that the only time someone stepped up in the playoffs when the Big 3 were not clicking? All these playoff series' and years? I doubt it.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 01:04 PM

Will someone answer the question?lol

Uwe Blab 06-12-13 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL (Post 1299123)
Will someone answer the question?lol

Are you asking why a shooter got on a hot streak? Just the law averages.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1299130)
Are you asking why a shooter got on a hot streak? Just the law averages.

It's not just one game. Where was Bonner from 08' to 12'? What did he do?

Uwe Blab 06-12-13 02:07 PM

43%, 48%, 31% and 46% shooting percentage this year in the playoffs. Not to mention he's not bad on defense. Not as bad you'd think.

clovisnmspurfan 06-12-13 02:18 PM

We win by 36 points last night and all you guys have to do is rag on Bonner?
Spurs are a TEAM which lives on contributions from the whole. Be happy and let's concentrate on winning the next game.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-12-13 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1299142)
43%, 48%, 31% and 46% shooting percentage this year in the playoffs. Not to mention he's not bad on defense. Not as bad you'd think.

2008-2012! is it that hard????????????
what were the numbers then???????????????

TimmyDthaWay2B 06-12-13 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1299142)
43%, 48%, 31% and 46% shooting percentage this year in the playoffs. Not to mention he's not bad on defense. Not as bad you'd think.

I disagree.... I guess it depends on the matchup. If its a big slow guu, he does alright... Works hard at the least.... Otherwise, he is a huge defensive liability.... With as many open looks as he gets.. He should be shooting 80 percent.

Jose_TheGenius 06-12-13 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL (Post 1299115)
Jose G did miss it...........AGAIN!

Jose is very smart and knows a lot about basketball(sometimes). But since I typed it........He has a knack of replying to what he wants to read or understand and not the whole picture of my point or points. He says I have a hate fetish for Bonner. Not really just being honest .....to be honest. I hated Rasho and they traded him to get Bonner which was an awesome move in 2006. Only thing was he got paid more and more to be an Horry replacement(slot wise) and has crumbled in the playoffs when the lights came on. Last night was not the only night a role player or two has stepped up Big 3 playing awesome or not. Thanks and I'm looking forward to someone answering that last question you have.

oh that's the point, then the question is easy.

Bonner has had 2009-2012 TD and the team alongside him. who the heck are you going to double from those years to get Bonner open?

Bonner never had a Tiago Splitter next to him either. in 2009 Bonner was our best big not named Tim Duncan. when you don't double TD, you stay on Bonner.

right now, you have to double TP off the pick and roll mainly because of Splitter's rolling and TD's shooting. you can't get both of that when Bonner is in there BUT you can get both of that when Green/Neal are in there.

end story, Parker set the tone. once Parker's passing and ball movement was activated, the Heat's game plan was exposed. if Parker didn't pass out of double teams and expose the Heat's plan, no way is there ball movement (especially 5 passes before a Neal J) to beat the Heat.

coming up with a thread on bashing Bonner just because is getting tiresome. Neal wasn't this good last season either because the team wasn't as good, same with Green. now they're getting open looks when they didn't last season. unless Bonner can play the 1-3 positions, he won't be getting the same air room that the Spurs two bigs give the perimeter guys.

tabspur 06-12-13 07:01 PM

Probably correct that now is not the time to bash Bonner. Or anyone, 2 games from another title. Bonner has had a horrible run in the playoffs historically. When defense intensifies and rotations speed up, he just doesn't have the agility or release to create his own shots, or even get his 3's off quick enough. He can't put it on the floor, and I think his last assist was probably in Toronto... He played well enough by comparison, the first 3 series this year. At least from what we come to expect. He's better at guarding someone who he can just body, and wait for help. Thats why he looked better vs the Grizz. Banged on Randolph, and hung on til the help arrived. This series is just another one that has bad matchup written on it for him. Any lateral movement, like guarding a Bosh, is way beyond his capability. Pop looks like he's going to throw him in for a few minutes, and see if he can knock down a shot or 2. If not, keep him on a short leash. Where was Diaw by the way? Are we settling in to playing 4 smalls at times?

WILLTHETHRILL 06-13-13 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius (Post 1299165)
oh that's the point, then the question is easy.

Bonner has had 2009-2012 TD and the team alongside him. who the heck are you going to double from those years to get Bonner open?

Bonner never had a Tiago Splitter next to him either. in 2009 Bonner was our best big not named Tim Duncan. when you don't double TD, you stay on Bonner.

right now, you have to double TP off the pick and roll mainly because of Splitter's rolling and TD's shooting. you can't get both of that when Bonner is in there BUT you can get both of that when Green/Neal are in there.

end story, Parker set the tone. once Parker's passing and ball movement was activated, the Heat's game plan was exposed. if Parker didn't pass out of double teams and expose the Heat's plan, no way is there ball movement (especially 5 passes before a Neal J) to beat the Heat.

coming up with a thread on bashing Bonner just because is getting tiresome. Neal wasn't this good last season either because the team wasn't as good, same with Green. now they're getting open looks when they didn't last season. unless Bonner can play the 1-3 positions, he won't be getting the same air room that the Spurs two bigs give the perimeter guys.


Random points:

You forgot 2008' he stunk then too.(non-championship year)

TD has been an all star all but one year not counting the lockout year. He has been double team worthy in part of those years you mentioned.

Didn't Neal hit a 3 pointer against the Grizz? When Manu was hurt. RJ sucked. TP and TD were not the same players? Neal was clutch. The same Gary Neal you said would be buried on the bench upon him signing from the summer league? Guess you know your basketball on that one.

Why do the shots always need to be wide open by you Bonner lovers???????? SJax had contested and or made wide open looks last playoffs? Bonner missed wide open in the past in the playoffs. Look at the stats. Nope sorry Jose G. Wrong again.

You are putting too much on the TP part. The Heat are mainly playing zone not man to man. They want to clog TP's driving but as with any zone......shooter's bust it open. Which they did in Game 3. The Heat have played the same type of zone all three games. Guarding spots not people most of the time. Bonner should be able to drain 3's against them period. It's a shooter's paradise.

Not making a thread just to bash Bonner. Bonner brings it on himself. They hardly play him not because of a short rotation but because he sucks when the bright lights come on when it counts. Look back at the last six playoff games. It proves it. GO SPURS GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

joyner 06-13-13 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL (Post 1299147)
2008-2012! is it that hard????????????
what were the numbers then???????????????

Holy ****, look up the damn statistics yourself. It's not rocket science, cripes. I don't even know why you made this topic, no one was talking about Bonner until you decided to bring him up. What's your creepy fascination with him?

WILLTHETHRILL 06-13-13 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joyner (Post 1299230)
Holy ****, look up the damn statistics yourself. It's not rocket science, cripes.

I'm not your slave and I was not referring to you BTW. You are Mr."GIVE SPLITTER 10 MILION BUCKS A YEAR" lol

PS I have posted the Bonner stats before many times. He sucks. Go to ESPN or something if you don't believe me.

GO SPURS GO
TRADE BONNER

joyner 06-13-13 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL (Post 1299232)
I'm not your slave and I was not referring to you BTW. You are Mr."GIVE SPLITTER 10 MILION BUCKS A YEAR" lol

PS I have posted the Bonner stats before many times. He sucks. Go to ESPN or something if you don't believe me.

GO SPURS GO
TRADE BONNER

You're screaming at everyone else to go look up the stats you're interested in, and yet when someone dares tell you to look them up yourself, you accuse them of treating YOU as their slave? What the **** is wrong with you? I'm starting to understand why everyone says to ignore you.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-13-13 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joyner (Post 1299236)
You're screaming at everyone else to go look up the stats you're interested in, and yet when someone dares tell you to look them up yourself, you accuse them of treating YOU as their slave? What the **** is wrong with you?

I've seen them what else do you want? I can't change his crummy playoff stats from years past. Go give Splitter all the Spurs cap money this summer if you want. You are alone on that parade.

joyner 06-13-13 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL (Post 1299237)
I've seen them what else do you want? I can't change his crummy playoff stats from years past. Go give Splitter all the Spurs cap money this summer if you want. You are alone on that parade.

So you're asking people to give you stats that you already know? That makes SO much more sense. I now understand why no one takes you seriously, thanks for making it so clear so fast.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-13-13 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joyner (Post 1299239)
So you're asking people to give you stats that you already know? That makes SO much more sense. I now understand why no one takes you seriously, thanks for making it so clear so fast.

They ignore the numbers is the point. Like you ignore giving Splitter too much free agent money!:slap

Uwe Blab 06-13-13 02:01 AM

Should we just change your name to WilltheTroll?

Rzarector7 06-13-13 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1299142)
43%, 48%, 31% and 46% shooting percentage this year in the playoffs. Not to mention he's not bad on defense. Not as bad you'd think.

Depends on the matchup, he sucks against GS and he is not good for this series! Matchup it depends on! Before this year though he just usually was bad in the playoffs, fact.

WILLTHETHRILL 06-13-13 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab (Post 1299249)
Should we just change your name to WilltheTroll?

yours to Monster Manu hater?


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