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  #1  
Old 06-08-13, 10:32 AM
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If Manu Ginobili Was Black, He'd Be Your Hero

If Manu Ginobili Was Black, He'd Be Your Hero
When tribalism and basketball intersect, this is what happens.

June 06, 2013, 06:25 PM EST by Khalid Salaam



No Spur will ever wear Number 20 again. At some point in the next few years, Manu Ginobil’s name will get the rafter raising treatment and with it, an accompanying ceremony replete with big lights and a standing ovation by the San Antonio faithful. After that, who knows? It’s likely he and his story will fade away into the retired player abyss of forgotten memories.

Truth is, that’s unfortunate. Ginobil was a great player, not quite transcendent, but undoubtedly one of the most impactful players so far of the 21st Century.

But he won’t get that level of appreciation. Why? Because the optics are bad.

All this time Manu’s career has been a study on how tribalism works. And you didn’t even know it.

Tribalism is roughly defined as a strong feeling of identity and loyalty to one's group. Can’t really say there’s anything wrong with that. For those who follow this way of thinking, it doesn’t mean they are bad people. Humans are social creatures, and thus predisposed to grouping with like-minded people. That includes language, culture, age, religion and race. Most of us know that there is a line of varying width between tribalism and racism. The ones that don’t recognize are, through entirely their own fault, forced to carry that hatred burden around with them.

It makes a mess outta life for the rest of us. These are the people that just found out that Senator John McCain’s son is marrying a black woman, and have commenced to make his online life hell. People have images in their minds of what works and when it doesn’t fit, all hell can break loose.

For a large contingent of black men in America, the sport of basketball and everything in its purview belongs to us. It doesn't matter that it wasn’t created by a black man – we grew it from a seed into the massive cultural extravaganza it is today. We own it. We hold tight to it and grip hard enough to cause callouses on our fingers. For those out there who pray at the altar of political correctness, this might sound perilously close to stereotyping. If that’s the case then close your ears. Just because something doesn’t sound right, it doesn’t matter. What does matter if it is right. As soon as you understand that, you’ll understand why Manu never had a chance to be fully embraced.

To be a star in the NBA, you gotta get that black man co-sign. No negotiating with that. If you’re not black, it’s gonna be rough. A few white guys slide in every couple of years. Larry Bird, Tom Chambers, Dan Majerle, Jason Williams, Kirk Hinrich, even the Birdman (Birdman!) You can’t get in, if you can’t play. And even once accepted, there are still gonna be doubters. But the eyes are cutting a little bit closer if you’re a dude from another country. You’re not black or American? Pfftt, that’s a tough one. It doesn’t matter that Manu is Argentinian and not “white” or even a “European.” The racial specificity needed here only matters that he’s not black.

In the last ten years, you name the shooting guards who have been better than Ginobili. I got Kobe, Wade, Allen, McGrady and Iverson. That’s it. Honestly, the last two are a bit of a reach. In total career output, Iverson and TMac blow Manu away, it's not even close. But from the mid ‘00s on, there’s an argument to be made. Iverson started falling off around ’07, ’08 and McGrady about the same time. Those dudes weren’t out there putting up impactful numbers on championship level squads. Meanwhile, during Ginobili’s peak from ‘05 to ‘11 he was as deft scorer. With playoff averages of 20.8, 18.4, 16.7, 17.8, 19.4 and 20.6, respectively. The rest of his resume includes two All-Star appearances and two All-NBA selections. He was the ‘08 Sixth Man Of The Year and made the Second Team All-Rookie back in ’02. He’s also only the second player ever to win an NBA title, Olympic Gold and a Euroleague title and he made the euro-step the behind the back pass of this generation. He also once mollywhopped a bat.





READ MORE HERE

You know we've all known this...
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  #2  
Old 06-08-13, 11:53 AM
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Larry Bird was black?
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Old 06-08-13, 11:57 AM
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I'm impressed that someone had the nerve to write what some have maintained for years, you'll never get the props you deserve from a large segment of basketball fans unless you have 'street cred' and you can bet not a single main stream sports site will pick this story up.
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Old 06-08-13, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurd_On View Post
Larry Bird was black?
He didn't say that he said "A few white guys slide in every couple of years. Larry Bird."..and then he listed others.
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Old 06-08-13, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by MichaelWi101 View Post
He didn't say that he said "A few white guys slide in every couple of years. Larry Bird."..and then he listed others.
Sorry. Just kidding. I should have put a smiley behind it. To be honest, I didn't even read the article because of the title.
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Old 06-08-13, 01:44 PM
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So after 10 years of TD, TP, and Manu not getting their due because they play in San Antonio instead of New York, now Manu doesn't get his due because he's white instead of black?
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Old 06-08-13, 01:47 PM
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Manu is an icon for Latin basketball. If others have a hard time accepting his extraordinary and unique skill set, it's too bad for them. I'm sure Manu will get along fine either way.

BTW, if Manu lacks street cred because he didn't come from the mean streets, why does Kobe have any?
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Old 06-08-13, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mckennaspur1 View Post
BTW, if Manu lacks street cred because he didn't come from the mean streets, why does Kobe have any?
Plays in LA, played HS ball in Philly and endorsed by Steven A Smith
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Old 06-08-13, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurd_On View Post
Sorry. Just kidding. I should have put a smiley behind it. To be honest, I didn't even read the article because of the title.


Read it... there are other videos on there... and it's a very good article.

one more...
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  #10  
Old 06-08-13, 02:18 PM
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Cant disagree.
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Old 06-08-13, 02:51 PM
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If you can play, you can play!! White, Black or otherwise. The same article could be written taking the stance that if Manu didn't play in a predominantly Hispanic/Latino city, he wouldn't be nearly as revered either.

Same argument!!
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Old 06-08-13, 03:23 PM
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IMO it is more a reflection of being on a small stage (SA). But who cares? He just wins. The other players in the NBA sure know who Manu is. So do the coaches. He is old now and his skills are not the same...but he still goes out there and competes.
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Old 06-08-13, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drcantgetright View Post
IMO it is more a reflection of being on a small stage (SA). But who cares? He just wins. The other players in the NBA sure know who Manu is. So do the coaches. He is old now and his skills are not the same...but he still goes out there and competes.
this!

we have the GREATEST PF of all time on the team and he's under-appreciated. Tim Duncan isn't exactly a "white guy". if people want to get technical on race, i'd still get ticked off at Manu for jacking up an ill advised three point shot with plenty of time left for the other team to win the game if he was white, black, or whatever else color there is out there.

the guy plays on a "small" stage with a "boring" team and people have hated him because, after Divac left, he was the flop king. that certainly wasn't because of his skin color either. Ginobili is just like the Yankees and the Cowboys, if he's on your team you love him and if he's against you, you hate him. right now he's with us at the decline of his career and he's trying to play like he did when he was younger and it's not working. that's the frustrating part. when someone writes an article based on race for no reason, it's either a cop out to try to make people feel guilty about not liking him right now or they want to stir the pot to get hits. it seems it might be both in this case.
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Old 06-08-13, 05:57 PM
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Parker too. How can anyone say this guy is boring to watch?!?1
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Old 06-08-13, 10:46 PM
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I think it has more to do with them not being American...more than not being black....although thats a factor. Then you got to realize too that Manu has had an injury-prone career so his stats aren't really superstar worthy.
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Old 06-09-13, 12:12 AM
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Our guys get no love not because of the color of their skin, not because they play in small-market San Antonio, it's because they are not American. Tim is an American Citizen true, but even he considers himself US Virgin Islands 1st. The NBA actually lists Tim as an International player.
NBA.com: Record-Tying 84 International Players on 2012-13 Opening-Night NBA Rosters

The real reason imho is NATIONALISM.
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  #17  
Old 06-09-13, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelWi101 View Post
Plays in LA, played HS ball in Philly and endorsed by Steven A Smith
Philly booed Kobe though, they don't even like the guy

The playing in LA part though, fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by polk View Post
If you can play, you can play!! White, Black or otherwise. The same article could be written taking the stance that if Manu didn't play in a predominantly Hispanic/Latino city, he wouldn't be nearly as revered either.

Same argument!!
I am in VA and people love Manu! I have know alot of hispanics though here say it helps them like him because of what he is and where he is from (And no not argies). To me it helps him just as much as it hurts him that he is not black! It has sure benefited him here and other places I know of. Manu always usually got his props too, people love to see him play be it whatever color and he was always entertaining to watch.

I won't get into color or this or that on this one because so much could be said about the article which some disagree or agree with! I only care about his play and what he has done here and what he can do now besides getting into a this or that debate. It helps him and goes against him I guess, but it has helped him more IMO because basketball is huge worldwide now and players of all races accepted, look at DIRK! Dirk is not hated on for his skin! He is loved for his game.
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Last edited by Rzarector7; 06-09-13 at 12:30 AM.
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Old 06-09-13, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flipmode Master View Post
I think it has more to do with them not being American...more than not being black....although thats a factor. Then you got to realize too that Manu has had an injury-prone career so his stats aren't really superstar worthy.
+1

Manu also has a high win % mainly towards that. he hasn't played as many games as TD & TP. When he's out, it's been those two. when he's been healthy and playing, it's been alongside those two. a lot of people don't put that into perspective either.
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Old 06-09-13, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TodTango View Post
Our guys get no love not because of the color of their skin, not because they play in small-market San Antonio, it's because they are not American. Tim is an American Citizen true, but even he considers himself US Virgin Islands 1st. The NBA actually lists Tim as an International player.
NBA.com: Record-Tying 84 International Players on 2012-13 Opening-Night NBA Rosters

The real reason imho is NATIONALISM.
Your argument relies on most people actually knowing that Duncan isn't American. I doubt that's the case.

People don't pay attention to the Spurs because the Spurs play in a small market and don't call attention to themselves. We've been saying that for 15 years. Nothing has changed, but now suddenly it's because of nationalism instead of what we've been saying it's about all along?

Steve Nash and Pau Gasol aren't American or black either, but they're both plenty popular. Why? Because Nash plays a flashier style of ball and Gasol plays in LA. Nothing's changed, people.
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Old 06-09-13, 04:43 PM
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He listed some good American players from the past but no CHRIS MULLIN????
That guy was a baller!
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  #21  
Old 06-10-13, 03:00 AM
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Surprised Dirk was left out too.
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  #22  
Old 06-10-13, 03:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SPURSGIRL4Life View Post
Surprised Dirk was left out too.
I mentioned DIRK myself, but I guess that doesn't count because I did not write that article ;)
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You could let it pick your brain for weeks and months, just replay it over and over, won't do you any good at all. When someone loses a loved one and they do that it only brings forth anguish. I feel acceptance is sometimes the key, it happened, now you have to react to it. Giving up is not an option.
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Old 06-10-13, 10:12 PM
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I mentioned DIRK myself, but I guess that doesn't count because I did not write that article ;)
Oops! What I meant to say was good call on noticing Dirk was not mentioned. Haha.
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  #24  
Old 06-11-13, 12:04 AM
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After all is said and done Manu's color is winner!
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Old 06-11-13, 01:30 PM
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Well thank gosh he's not, cause if he keeps playing like this, the locals might be looking for the rope over the tree! Bad humor, but he'll have his statue in the hall of fame with a few titles, Olympic title, sixth man award, all star appearances and a wonderful legacy from his fans who cared for him the most and the ones he played for. P.S., I'm African American and I wish I was Manu!
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Old 06-11-13, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by MRJONESIII View Post
Well thank gosh he's not, cause if he keeps playing like this, the locals might be looking for the rope over the tree! Bad humor, but he'll have his statue in the hall of fame with a few titles, Olympic title, sixth man award, all star appearances and a wonderful legacy from his fans who cared for him the most and the ones he played for. P.S., I'm African American and I wish I was Manu!
bald spot and all?!
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Old 06-11-13, 04:12 PM
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bald spot and all?!
Hell yeah! All I'd have to do is go to the barber and have him cut me a #2 just left of my spot!
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Old 06-11-13, 08:04 PM
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OK - I'm a little tired of the Duncan isn't American thing. He is from the U.S. (that's United States) Virgin Islands. He is 100% a native born American citizen.
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Old 06-12-13, 06:16 AM
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OK - I'm a little tired of the Duncan isn't American thing. He is from the U.S. (that's United States) Virgin Islands. He is 100% a native born American citizen.
Bill Simmons summed it all up:

the Spurs never had the right opponent to play against in the Finals.

they were always the favorites and everyone expected them to win.

i'm with you Robofuzz, the nationality talk and the race talk is idiotic. if someone thinks the Spurs are boring, they're ignorant towards the game of basketball. that is all, nothing more.
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Old 06-12-13, 12:56 PM
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They were always the favorites to win but the Pistons series was very close in 2005. Now they are the underdog and the road team. But the pistons Finals were tough. And they were the defending champions too.
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  #31  
Old 06-12-13, 04:36 PM
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stupid article, you would think they could spell the subject of the articles name correctly? It is spelled G I N O B I L I, not GINOBIL
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Old 06-13-13, 12:39 PM
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Not just international....I think it is the fact he is from Argetnina....not based on the color of his skin. I think Argentinian's get a "cocky" label from their fellow south americans/latinos. If Manu was from Miami, Texas or New Mexico....I think he would be a bigger star.....without darkening his skin.

By the way, I thought Manu held his own against Kobe in the 2003 playoffs. Not saying he was better, but he was right these with the best player in the game during his prime.
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