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  #1  
Old 08-19-12, 10:58 PM
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Is Tiago Splitter a Bust?

Tiago Splitter has been underachieving since joining the San Antonio Spurs. He has shown glimpses of solid play but it hasn’t been enough to justify starting the former Spanish League MVP.

The NBA’s Western Conference has just gotten tougher with the arrival of Dwight Howard to the Lakers and the Spurs are going to need some size to weather the storm.

MVP Texas | Is Tiago Splitter a Bust?




Hmmmmm is he?
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Old 08-19-12, 11:15 PM
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I dont think he is I think if he had the PT he would be a solid player.
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Old 08-20-12, 01:38 AM
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Expecting him to be an All Star is not realistic enough. He´s a poor man´s Scola.
So he can be a solid contributor, but not an AllStar.
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Old 08-20-12, 08:37 AM
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I think expectations are faily high for any Euro player coming to play for the Spurs due to the success of TP/Manu. He has been very inconsistant and a bit of a dissapoinment but at the same time, I think he could still be a solid contributer with constitant minutes. 20/10 will never be realistic with him. I'll be happy with a 10/7 stat which he is fully capable of. He's still very young and only entering his 3rd season. I'm gonna give him one more season (this season) to show me something before I make anymore judgement on him.
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Old 08-20-12, 08:56 AM
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The writer's assessment of Splitter's game or lack thereof was right on the money. Fixing these deficiencies does not turn him into an All-Star but simply a valuable lunch pale player who is an asset to his team and worth putting on the floor. He came into the League being described as NBA-ready but without these basics in his game he is far from it.
I'm not giving up on Splitter just yet and I will be pulling for him but this is his make or break season.
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Old 08-20-12, 10:20 AM
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He's a bust if you were expecting him to become an anchor for this team for years to come, which most on this board expected. He's actually not a bad player, but he's soft, has no jump shot and not athletic enough to play great defense, only decent defense. He's a good bench player who can play well with distributors. That's it. He doesn't need more playing time to show that.
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Old 08-20-12, 11:04 AM
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I don't think the sensible Spurs fan thought he was going to be an all-star but for him to atleast be a starter on such a small team.

Just seems kinda odd, a Spanish MVP can't get more minutes when his only competition are undersized power forwards.
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Old 08-20-12, 11:16 AM
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A bust???? Seriously???

Let's see now, due to injuries he played in only 60 games in his first season, his second year he played in 59 games and except for games started and steals per game every single one of his stats went up.

To me most folks are upset at his failure to respond during crunch time during the Thunder series, but he wasn't the only one who disappeared during those games either.

Is he the answer to DH? Of course not, but then again nobody else in the league is either. Is he able to give the Spurs some good quality minutes, yes and frankly I'd rather see him on the floor than either Bonner or the undersized Blair.

Will he be a superstar, probably not, but I do think he'll be an integral part of the Spurs in the future, but this year will be his most important one,he has to show growth and the ability to play tough all the time.
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Old 08-20-12, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flipmode Master View Post
I don't think the sensible Spurs fan thought he was going to be an all-star but for him to atleast be a starter on such a small team.

Just seems kinda odd, a Spanish MVP can't get more minutes when his only competition are undersized power forwards.
i think him on the bench is not entirely his fault. Pop had to think of a decent front court shuffle with his bigs. i think Blair starting isn't Splitter's fault but more Bonner and Blair's inability to play next to each other which forced Pop to start the one who doesn't pair well with Splitter off the bench.

Diaw really brings some experiments that Pop can do. he can fit next to Blair, Splitter, or Bonner which might help start Tiago and have Diaw off the bench (or start Blair and bring Diaw/Splitter off the bench). he might have a bigger impact this upcoming year than years before.
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Old 08-20-12, 01:29 PM
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The guy was a very late first round pick. What do you expect? Also if he was born in the U.S. then I guess he would not be a bust. Seems like foreign players have to be All Stars as soon as their sneakers hit the floor in an NBA game. Look at all the Rubio haters they claimed he sucked pointing to his stats. I'm a stats guy BUT.........Funny thing is Euro leagues do not play 48 minute games! Also the teams play almost the entire roster in the all the games. No short rotations. So people's views on foreign basketball players is so warped it shows their lack of basketball knowledge. I repeat he is not a bust! Look at where he was drafted folks!
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Old 08-20-12, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
i think him on the bench is not entirely his fault. Pop had to think of a decent front court shuffle with his bigs. i think Blair starting isn't Splitter's fault but more Bonner and Blair's inability to play next to each other which forced Pop to start the one who doesn't pair well with Splitter off the bench.

Diaw really brings some experiments that Pop can do. he can fit next to Blair, Splitter, or Bonner which might help start Tiago and have Diaw off the bench (or start Blair and bring Diaw/Splitter off the bench). he might have a bigger impact this upcoming year than years before.
Valid points but i dont think anyone is focused on him being quote on quote "starter" but atleast be the best center on the team...and we cant even say that without a little doubt...after two seasons.
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Old 08-20-12, 04:46 PM
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Yeah, agree w/ most of the earlier posts - wouldn't be so quick/brutal to label him a bust. Buuuuut...Marc Gasol was drafted in late second round of that same draft. So there you go. Do what you will with that piece of info.
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  #13  
Old 08-20-12, 05:29 PM
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Here is Tiago Splitter's contribution to the team last regular season:

Points: 6th total, 6th per game (excluding Patty Mills)
Rebounds: 4th total, 3rd per game
Blks: 2nd total, 2nd per game (note avg 0.8 blks per game)
Minutes Played: 9th total, 11th per game (RJ and SJax counted as 1 player)

Looking at his stats, I would have to say he is a mild disappointment bordering on bust. Offensively he's been adequate. I can't complain about Tiago being our sixth best scorer playing out of the Center position. If we were to consider a Tiago a "starter", I would expect the 4 other starters plus the first swingman off the bench to score more so he is right where he should be.

The problem is on the defensive end. As a "starting" center, I would expect him to be the second best rebounder and blocker on the team behind Tim Duncan. While on the surface, he is meeting expectations in blocks, his rebounding numbers are not good. The main problem with this analysis is that Pop was running so deep with his rotations that minutes were hard to come by. After the big 2, Duncan and Parker, players 3-10 on the rotation were clustered between 19-24 minutes per game. If you look at Tiago's per 36 rebounding, it is a much more acceptable 9.8 per 36 min. The blocks however are still at 1.5. My expectation of an effective center should be around 2 per 36 so by that measure it is a negative.

He is 27 years old. By my general rule of thumb, that is the age were NBA players usually reach the peak of their careers. After that age you still gain skill and experience, but it starts being offset by losses in athleticism. At this point in his career, I just don't see any big improvements coming along.

Last edited by b1gdon; 08-20-12 at 05:41 PM.
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Old 08-20-12, 06:36 PM
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I didn't know a guy who averaged nine points per game is considered a bust these days in the NBA? I think normally the late first rounders are expected to be rotation guys at the very least. He is in the rotation. The Marc Gasol comment.....okay I was one who wanted him before he was drafted and it's not normal for guys drafted that late to become All Stars. It's rare and everyone knows that. Rookie year okay Splitter sucked but he was injured pretty much the whole season. I think the expectations bar was set too high for him. I was always a Scola lover before he got to the NBA.....lol. But never considered myself a Splitter lover before he got here. So don't label me in that fashion. I just said he was not going to be a bust. I think Splitter can improve but for now.....................Go Scola!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 08-20-12, 07:40 PM
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He's not a bust to me, because I never expected him to do much. In fact, he's probably exceeded my expectations already. But he's not going to get any better. This isn't some 21 year old, he's 27. He's set in his ways, he's not athletic to begin with. All you can do with him is work a little on his non-existent jumpshot, make sure Tony and Manu get him involved in the pick and roll, but even that is easily defendable, because he doesn't have a jumpshot. Is he a starter? Probably not, because Diaw is already better. And if he can't start on a team with no legit bigs, than he really isn't that good.
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Old 08-20-12, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orient Express View Post
Yeah, agree w/ most of the earlier posts - wouldn't be so quick/brutal to label him a bust. Buuuuut...Marc Gasol was drafted in late second round of that same draft. So there you go. Do what you will with that piece of info.
Comparing apples and oranges. Marc has been in the league for 4 years vs Tiago's 2, let's compare after Tiago has been playing for 4 years.
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Old 08-20-12, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by MichaelWi101 View Post
Comparing apples and oranges. Marc has been in the league for 4 years vs Tiago's 2, let's compare after Tiago has been playing for 4 years.
that and Gasol got minutes and the ball in the post, while our aging Duncan (sadly to this day) gets the ball in 4 Downs and takes touches, even if he can't get by the guy
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Old 08-21-12, 12:37 AM
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Sorry, Jose, it's not as easy as that. Gasol is immensely more skilled than Tiago, regardless of amount of touches. He's also a better rebounder, a better shot blocker, and has a mid range shot. He had those coming into the league. Splitter didn't.
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Old 08-21-12, 01:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uwe Blab View Post
Sorry, Jose, it's not as easy as that. Gasol is immensely more skilled than Tiago, regardless of amount of touches. He's also a better rebounder, a better shot blocker, and has a mid range shot. He had those coming into the league. Splitter didn't.
I agree with all of that but I am still willing to give Tiago the benefit of the doubt if the Spurs coaching staff can instil these habits in him before the playoffs. Simply being tall and able to move around quickly and run the floor is not going to cut it.

And I could care less where he was picked in the draft or the years in the league or whatever. The bottom line is whether he is an asset to the Spurs in any manor they deem worthwhile.

Last edited by Spurd_On; 08-21-12 at 01:38 AM.
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Old 08-21-12, 07:07 AM
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The Spurs have never developed a big man. The team will spend time and energy on developing their wings, bring in a shot tutor, but there's never been a single coach on this staff (to the best of my memory) who has known how to play as a true 'big' or to teach those skills.

If you don't come to the team with a major skill set, then you're not going to get better being on the Spurs. Marc Gasol had his brother Pau to work with, I wonder how much time Tiago gets with anyone who can help him get better, I'm sure Chip works on his free throws, but what about his post moves,what about his rebounding techniques, is he going to learn from Bonner???? or Blair???

Spurs should send him to a big man camp or have him work with the Dream in Houston.
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Old 08-21-12, 01:02 PM
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I think the problem with Tiago Splitter is people thought he was gonna come in and be the next Duncan or Robinson for this team. He didn't turn out to be that nor did he ever have the potential to be that. So, in the eyes of those people he would be considered a bust. But, me personally I don't think he is a bust. I thought he would come in a be a role playing piece for this team and he has been that. He is solid on the pick and roll, he gives effort everytime he gets minutes and while he is not a great defender he is a servicable defender. 6'11-7'0 Centers are hard to come by and he gives The Spurs at least that. I don't see any reason why he can't be a servicable piece for the Spurs for the immediate future.
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  #22  
Old 08-21-12, 07:49 PM
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the is just that, so many thought he would or wanted more than serviceable, which he is, but I do not think anyone WITHIN the Spurs ever expected he would be the next super stud center for the Spurs. To that end he seems t be doing pretty much what has been asked of him. As such, if you are doing what is expected of you, you are not a bust.

Good, experienced big man coaches are possibly harder to come by than are good big men.
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  #23  
Old 08-21-12, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbp82 View Post
I think the problem with Tiago Splitter is people thought he was gonna come in and be the next Duncan or Robinson for this team. He didn't turn out to be that nor did he ever have the potential to be that. So, in the eyes of those people he would be considered a bust. But, me personally I don't think he is a bust. I thought he would come in a be a role playing piece for this team and he has been that. He is solid on the pick and roll, he gives effort everytime he gets minutes and while he is not a great defender he is a servicable defender. 6'11-7'0 Centers are hard to come by and he gives The Spurs at least that. I don't see any reason why he can't be a servicable piece for the Spurs for the immediate future.
I don't know about stud center. I was looking for at least a Rasho Nesterovich and at this point he's not there. Offensively he's better, but he is nowhere near as close on defense.
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  #24  
Old 08-22-12, 12:26 AM
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I said it many times since the day he was drafted: he's soft as butter, he lacks confidence and he was nothing else but a decent bench player. He got slightly better (go figure!) in the time between he was drafted and the time he joined Spurs, but I think he's hitting his ceiling. He was molded after Oberto (he was his mentor as well) so at most I expected Oberto's intangibles. I think he might achieve that with experience, but really, he won't get better in any tangible. On the other hand... he's a reserve. For a reserve, he's OK, you don't need DH off the bench. So I would be more worried about the starters than the reserve players
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Old 08-22-12, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL View Post
The guy was a very late first round pick. What do you expect? Also if he was born in the U.S. then I guess he would not be a bust. Seems like foreign players have to be All Stars as soon as their sneakers hit the floor in an NBA game. Look at all the Rubio haters they claimed he sucked pointing to his stats. I'm a stats guy BUT.........Funny thing is Euro leagues do not play 48 minute games! Also the teams play almost the entire roster in the all the games. No short rotations. So people's views on foreign basketball players is so warped it shows their lack of basketball knowledge. I repeat he is not a bust! Look at where he was drafted folks!
I wanna say he was drafted 28th but during that draft year he was actually projected as a late lottery pick. Of course you always have that one player "slip through the crack" on draft day and fall in your lap. That happened to be Tiago for us, but to get back on track.....Splitter was projected a lot higher in the draft then he went, so I honsetly think the draft argument is pointless....anyways, I'm still waiting to see what he does this year before for I make a judgement call. Clearly, he has not performed up to expectations as the Spanish league MVP, just sayin
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  #26  
Old 08-22-12, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Uwe Blab View Post
Sorry, Jose, it's not as easy as that. Gasol is immensely more skilled than Tiago, regardless of amount of touches. He's also a better rebounder, a better shot blocker, and has a mid range shot. He had those coming into the league. Splitter didn't.
"regardless of amount of touches", Marc Gasol has played more than 30mpg his whole NBA career and was their go to guy in the post for most of that time.

are you sure that doesn't matter? because that matters a lot, especially in development. he might be more skilled than Tiago, but Tiago hasn't actually gotten the same chances as him.
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Old 08-22-12, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
"regardless of amount of touches", Marc Gasol has played more than 30mpg his whole NBA career and was their go to guy in the post for most of that time.

are you sure that doesn't matter? because that matters a lot, especially in development. he might be more skilled than Tiago, but Tiago hasn't actually gotten the same chances as him.
Minutes and production are two related stats which makes trying to control for them difficult. If Tiago was a more productive player, he would get more minutes which would boost his stats. Also, players who play more minutes play against better competition and compete for touches with better players, so their production per minute is dragged down. Overall though, you can look at a guy who plays 30+ minutes per game like Marc Gasol, look at his per minute and per game production and compare it to Splitter and see that there is NO COMPARISON. Gasol is a much more talented player and it bares out in the stats.
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Old 08-22-12, 02:28 PM
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Minutes and production are two related stats which makes trying to control for them difficult. If Tiago was a more productive player, he would get more minutes which would boost his stats. Also, players who play more minutes play against better competition and compete for touches with better players, so their production per minute is dragged down. Overall though, you can look at a guy who plays 30+ minutes per game like Marc Gasol, look at his per minute and per game production and compare it to Splitter and see that there is NO COMPARISON. Gasol is a much more talented player and it bares out in the stats.
i'm not arguing that Gasol isn't a better overall athlete, the point of my point is that (if someone wants to compare them, which they did) they haven't had the same opportunities and Gasol has had more opportunities to succeed than Splitter has, most which are coaching decisions, not because of his play.

Marc Gasol went to a team that was going to be his and he was going to be the main guy in the post with the Grizzlies supplementing players to help him out. Splitter came to the Spurs having to adjust to Duncan's 4 Down plays (and really not being effective because he's not a mid range player to succeed in that). the majority of the minutes going to Duncan and (up until some of last year Duncan showing a consistent jumper) Splitter has had no one to compliment him because Blair started and Bonner gets few minutes. if before Blair can't play with Bonner (forcing Splitter to play next to Matt) or Duncan trying to adjust to Splitter a little bit, how would Splitter get more minutes even if he was extremely good? do you think if Tiago was extremely better than Duncan (for argument's sake) but couldn't play next to Duncan, would we bench Tim? that'd be an easy no.

that's really the whole point. the Grizzlies have catered to Gasol while the Spurs have forced Tiago to change his game to fit with this team. if you match Splitter's minutes with Gasol's and adjust the numbers, they'd look pretty close. there's just a lot of factors to the comparison, but they're not remotely close. Tiago could be a way better player if he was able to play like he could.
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  #29  
Old 08-22-12, 04:43 PM
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Gasol has Randolph playing on the same lineup, and has managed to play very well, and earn lots of minutes. If Splitter were that good, believe me, they would have given him more minutes and yes even taken some minutes away from Duncan because they still want to preserve him. And Duncan played the least minutes of his career last year. There's no excuse Jose. Kawhi started off on the bench, but his great play basically forced the Spurs to give him more minutes.

I'm not saying Splitter completely sucks, but he's as good as he's going to get. And again, Gasol had the skills when he got drafted. He just adjusted to the NBA game. Splitter doesn't have those skills, and at 27 I doubt he will be "developed" into something else.
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Old 08-22-12, 05:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esparzar1 View Post
I wanna say he was drafted 28th but during that draft year he was actually projected as a late lottery pick. Of course you always have that one player "slip through the crack" on draft day and fall in your lap. That happened to be Tiago for us, but to get back on track.....Splitter was projected a lot higher in the draft then he went, so I honsetly think the draft argument is pointless....anyways, I'm still waiting to see what he does this year before for I make a judgement call. Clearly, he has not performed up to expectations as the Spanish league MVP, just sayin
So what Blair was projected lottery his draft year and Jeremy Tyler was at one time #1 overall projected too. Both second round picks. Your wrong on the projected late lottery projection in 2007 for Splitter. Before 2007........his projection was late lottery not the same situation. Perry Jones was supposed to be top 5 and Sullinger top 10. They slipped but their most current projections were not lottery. Yes Spanish league MVP should do more. I agree with you on that but again late first rounders are PROJECTED to be rotation guys. He is a rotation guy. He met his quota draft wise in my eyes.
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  #31  
Old 08-23-12, 04:08 PM
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Tiago splitter has not underachieved. At least not last year. He was at an all star level of efficiency. He did play off the bench, so that does skew the stats a little bit because he is not typically playing against starters, but he plays at an extremely high level, plays smart, plays hard, scores with great efficiency, and it does so without complaining at a reasonable price. There are a ton of teams who would love to have this guy on their roster. So I suggest we not complain about guys who have improved and can still get better. No, he's not David Robinson or Tim Duncan, but he's light-years ahead of guys like Darko.
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  #32  
Old 08-23-12, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grizzly_bexar View Post
Tiago splitter has not underachieved. At least not last year. He was at an all star level of efficiency. He did play off the bench, so that does skew the stats a little bit because he is not typically playing against starters, but he plays at an extremely high level, plays smart, plays hard, scores with great efficiency, and it does so without complaining at a reasonable price. There are a ton of teams who would love to have this guy on their roster. So I suggest we not complain about guys who have improved and can still get better. No, he's not David Robinson or Tim Duncan, but he's light-years ahead of guys like Darko.
Well said Grizz..... problem here is with the hype every unknown starter gets on this board even TD would be a bust if he started now "not athletic enough, doesn't have an outside shot to spread the defence... look at this random stat....."
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Old 08-23-12, 08:02 PM
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I really think people are just being naive, the guy hasn't performed...he has been glued to the bench for two seasons. No one expected him to be an all-star but to atleast play nice portion minutes...19 mins a game is NOT significant.

People say Pop's holding him back but the Spurs were horrible at defending the rim WCF's...and Splitter (7foot tall)..barely played..STILL lol.

So either he isn't where he suppose to be or Pop is just pissed at the guy for no reason.
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Old 08-23-12, 08:20 PM
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Glued to the bench? Well, the first year he was injured for critical stretches and couldn't really get into the row Tatian because he didn't know the system. Then pop went to him when we had no other option and although he was raw, he performed well. I mean in the Memphis series. Then last year, again with very little opportunity for off-season development due to the lockout, he performed at an extremely high level at 19 minutes a game as you said. His efficiency rating is at about 21 point something per game, which puts him right about the top 10 in his position across the league. That is not a guy who is glued to the bench or a guy who is a bust. Now he has played very well off the bench against opposing bench players and contributed greatly to our offense of efficiency in the second unit.

That in mind, I don't want to say he's the best thing to come along since perforated toilet paper, but he is playing very well and has room for improvement. In my opinion, he is extremely skilled and intelligent, but not physically tough or imposing. He takes charges and rotates pretty well, but at times in the playoffs he showed a level of confusion and lack of hustle that was disappointing. He definitely needs to improve, but even without improvement, he is not a blast and he is a very highly skilled big man.

Short version: he is an extremely smart and skilled big man who helps out our offenses efficiency in the second unit like probably no other big man in the league does for his team, but he is not a shot blocker or grade rebounder or intimidating physical presence, and has a lot of work to do with mental and physical toughness.
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Old 08-24-12, 05:13 PM
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January or February of this year is better measuring stick.

As Grizz stated, the rookie year included a good deal of time (and pretty much all of training camp) with the calf injury. When he got healthy, he appeared okay, but lost.
Last year, he was inconsistent. I can only hope that it's because of the lockout. Comfort in Pop's system doesn't come easily. Maybe a full training camp, some time with Chip and extensive time just talking with the coaches over the summer will help.

His pseudo-ceiling is good starter, above average bench 5. He's a guy that needs to be good, not great. Just don't be a guy who teams exploit.

Come March-June, we'll know for sure. No need to brand the guy just yet.
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Old 12-09-12, 04:30 PM
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Just thought I'd resurrect this from the dead thread world....

Personally I'd say that so far this year, he's been anything but a bust
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  #37  
Old 12-09-12, 05:30 PM
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This is a nice rising from the dead topic. When Tiago was hurt in training camp his first year and took so long to recuperate, I thought he might be a bust. But he took a few years to acclimate to the Spurs system and I believe he’s rounding out just fine. He’s excellent on the pick n roll, hits the boards well, plays some decent defense and he runs the court better than any big man I’ve seen, outside Duncan. I think we need to reassign him. Now, the topic has arisen and remains on the table that the Spurs need another big, to which I agree. But I don’t support giving up Tiago for another big, unless that big is better than and, without a doubt, can outplay Splitter. That big has to hit the ground running before doning the silver and black. And just because another big might fit this prerequisite, remember, that big has to acclimate himself to Pop’s system and teammates immediately while Splitter is already there. IMHO, of course.
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  #38  
Old 12-09-12, 05:36 PM
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he got no muscle. he like gumby when a point gaurd gaurds him in the post he gets all shaken up.
hit the weights and man up
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  #39  
Old 12-10-12, 12:09 PM
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GO SPLITTER!lol
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  #40  
Old 12-10-12, 01:04 PM
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NO!!
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  #41  
Old 12-10-12, 03:38 PM
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He's a backup, which is what I expected.
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  #42  
Old 12-10-12, 06:33 PM
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Splitter is not a bust. He had tremendous efficiency #'s and shooting percentage.

He is not an intimidator or a power rebounder, but he plays hard and is a very effective, if soft, finisher. And he helps his teammates play better by setting good screens and rotating for charges.
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  #43  
Old 12-10-12, 09:57 PM
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Tiago is only a bust if you were asking him to be the next TD. He's a very solid second-tier center in this league. Nothing spectacular, but a lunch-pail guy who gets the job done. Reminds me alot of Oberto.
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