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  #1  
Old 08-04-12, 12:40 PM
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Chris Andersen Open To Signing For Veteran's Minimum

Chris Andersen Open To Signing For Veterans Minimum - RealGM Wiretap
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  #2  
Old 08-04-12, 01:21 PM
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For the vet minimum, heck yeah. Do it yesterday.
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  #3  
Old 08-04-12, 01:28 PM
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Was he cleared of all charges? If yes.........I would sign him.
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  #4  
Old 08-04-12, 04:40 PM
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not a good fit, wouldn't work and he would be behind blair.
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  #5  
Old 08-04-12, 04:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
not a good fit, wouldn't work and he would be behind blair.
How is he a bad fit on the court?
How would he not work?
Behind Blair? Andersen is a shot blocker.......so I highly doubt that. Other than Tim they don't have one.
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  #6  
Old 08-04-12, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL View Post
How is he a bad fit on the court?
How would he not work?
Behind Blair? Andersen is a shot blocker.......so I highly doubt that. Other than Tim they don't have one.
Exactly, I would take him for energy and athleticism off the bench even in at the same time with Timmy
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  #7  
Old 08-04-12, 05:02 PM
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well he isnt the rebounder blair is and just because he can block shots doesnt mean he's a good defender. He just wouldnt fit in this system compared to what they run in denver and he's also a problem off the court.
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  #8  
Old 08-04-12, 05:05 PM
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I say go for it.

Here is what Hollinger has to say about him.

+ Slim, graffitied big man who excels at running floor and blocking shots.

+ Poor shooter. Can finish shots around basket and draws heaps of fouls.

+ Good rebounder but can be overpowered by stronger post players.

Andersen missed 37 games with knee problems and came back slowly, but by April he was looking like the old Birdman -- in 20 games after the All-Star break, he shot 73.9 percent and blocked more than one shot every nine minutes. For the season, he finished fifth among centers in blocks per minute and 14th in steals, and although he giddily bites on shot fakes, Andersen's defensive value still shows up in the numbers. According to basketballvalue.com, Denver gave up 5.38 points per 100 possessions less with him on the court.

Offensively, Andersen has become a free throw machine over the past two seasons. Attacking the rim on pick-and-roll dives and open-court situations, he averaged a whopping 0.99 free throw attempts per field goal attempt, the league's second-best figure (see chart). And unlike other players on this list, Andersen wasn't somebody teams sought to foul. He made 63.7 percent from the stripe and is a career 64.4 percent shooter -- not Reggie Miller, perhaps, but not worth Hack-a-Bird either.

Because of all the free throws, Andersen ranked seventh among centers in TS%. And in a pleasant surprise he took care of the ball too, finishing 22nd at his position in pure point rating. Finally, despite his slim frame he again finished above the mean for centers in rebound rate.

Andersen is a Fluke Rule player (see Lamar Odom comment) and thus is unlikely to be quite this good a year from now, but the Nuggets will trade a lower PER for more minutes and games. He played only 732 minutes last season and will likely double that figure with a healthy 2011-12.
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  #9  
Old 08-04-12, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
well he isnt the rebounder blair is and just because he can block shots doesnt mean he's a good defender. He just wouldnt fit in this system compared to what they run in denver and he's also a problem off the court.
Not as a good a rebounder I agree but that's it. Blocking and altering shots does not always mean a good defender but is Blair or Bonner going to deter people in the paint? Nope! Funny you mention systems because Denver's dribble drive offense is a motion offense. The Spurs run a motion offense that gives the players options based on their court positions and spacing. Spurs do tons of pick and rolls and so do the nuggets. The Spurs push the ball more than any other time in the TD era. Denver always pushes the ball too. You don't run plays for Andersen. He is a garbage man around the paint on both ends. Off court yeah he had a drug issue years ago.The K-porn stuff.....LIKE I SAID........if he was cleared of all charges only! FBI and other agencies have broken into the wrong houses before LOTS of times. Maybe his chick set him up? Maybe his wireless feed was tapped into from a dirtbag neighbor.......who knows?! Innocent until proven guilty. If he is not innocent of ALL charges......yes stay away from him. ON THE COURT............he does fit sorry man. Study the teams. Denver is a close match on lots of their offensive schemes to the Spurs. Also he sets good picks. That's not something all players do well. Plus he is open to the the vet min. but they will have to trade a big somewhere down the road.
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  #10  
Old 08-04-12, 06:08 PM
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Blair in the paint is better on both sides of the ball than Anderson. Not only would he not fit on the court with the team but wouldn't fit off the court with his legal issues which the team dont need. Sorry but the team wont even give him a thought.
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  #11  
Old 08-04-12, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL View Post
How is he a bad fit on the court?
How would he not work?
Behind Blair? Andersen is a shot blocker.......so I highly doubt that. Other than Tim they don't have one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by silvernblackfan View Post
Exactly, I would take him for energy and athleticism off the bench even in at the same time with Timmy
he can't shoot (really good FG% but that's because he doesn't shoot enough to make him earn it) and he's not a great man defender. the offense disqualifies him being paired up with Splitter & Blair and the defense anchor part disqualifies him being paired up with Bonner. he can block shots, but he goes for everything which isn't a good thing.

the guy's career rebounds per game stat is around 5, isn't that what we help in? Blair could do better than that in the time given (hell even Bonner).

there's a reason why the guy would sign for the minimum: because he couldn't crack a depleted Nuggets rotation last year. the guy wouldn't play over Splitter anyway, so we'd just be upgrading Blair/Bonner which isn't a necessity. without the amnesty being available, i think we're just cracking under the luxury tax and Birdman isn't worth cutting the end of our bench to go there.
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  #12  
Old 08-05-12, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
Blair in the paint is better on both sides of the ball than Anderson. Not only would he not fit on the court with the team but wouldn't fit off the court with his legal issues which the team dont need. Sorry but the team wont even give him a thought.
As I already stated the legal issues would have to be cleared first anyway and I'm sure the NBA would have a say so if he moved forward on a future contract with anyone. Blair? Where was he in the last two playoffs? You forgot Bonner too. You never explained why he would not fit??????
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  #13  
Old 08-05-12, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
he can't shoot (really good FG% but that's because he doesn't shoot enough to make him earn it) and he's not a great man defender. the offense disqualifies him being paired up with Splitter & Blair and the defense anchor part disqualifies him being paired up with Bonner. he can block shots, but he goes for everything which isn't a good thing.

the guy's career rebounds per game stat is around 5, isn't that what we help in? Blair could do better than that in the time given (hell even Bonner).

there's a reason why the guy would sign for the minimum: because he couldn't crack a depleted Nuggets rotation last year. the guy wouldn't play over Splitter anyway, so we'd just be upgrading Blair/Bonner which isn't a necessity. without the amnesty being available, i think we're just cracking under the luxury tax and Birdman isn't worth cutting the end of our bench to go there.
Who cares if he can't shoot. Rodman couldn't shoot and he is in the hall of fame! I wouldn't pair him with Blair because I would move Blair and Bonner out. I already stated Blair was a better rebounder but not Bonner. Don't cut your own nose to disagree with me on that with Bonner and his pathetic rebounding. I never said sign Birdman and go past the luxury tax. I never said that. I said one or two bigs had to be moved. As far as the Denver rotation, They had tons of big men to use. I went to a Nuggets/Spurs game and saw Andersen play and not in a mop role. As you know!........playoff rotations shorten normally. Also the career rebounding stat for Andersen is actually good since he is a career BENCH player. That's not terrible for a guy who does not start.
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  #14  
Old 08-05-12, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL View Post
Who cares if he can't shoot. Rodman couldn't shoot and he is in the hall of fame! I wouldn't pair him with Blair because I would move Blair and Bonner out. I already stated Blair was a better rebounder but not Bonner. Don't cut your own nose to disagree with me on that with Bonner and his pathetic rebounding. I never said sign Birdman and go past the luxury tax. I never said that. I said one or two bigs had to be moved. As far as the Denver rotation, They had tons of big men to use. I went to a Nuggets/Spurs game and saw Andersen play and not in a mop role. As you know!........playoff rotations shorten normally. Also the career rebounding stat for Andersen is actually good since he is a career BENCH player. That's not terrible for a guy who does not start.
who cares if he can't shoot? you put him next to Blair or Splitter and there's 3-4 guys in the paint challenging us to shoot (kind of like last year) and we get tossed, but you're right, you're just comparing him to a HALL OF FAMER! that makes no sense, they don't have the same level of intensity or skill.

we can't move Bonner or Blair apparently, so we'd have to release them and go over the luxury tax. it's easy for Spurs fans to say "do it!" but there has to be stuff done to make it happen. we're not trading Bonner, if we could we would have traded him already. the same goes with Blair.

"career bench player", again he had guys in Denver who could shoot (Nene would just abuse people inside and K-Mart had a jumper there, do you think Splitter can handle a double team or bully his way to the basket?) he wouldn't work here if you'd play him next to Tiago or Blair and our defense wouldn't improve with him next to Bonner. you'd have to play him next to Duncan or Diaw, which would mean starting Splitter or Bonner or Blair. by the way this team looks right now, Pop may start Diaw which would then leave Splitter off the bench with Mills/Manu/Jackson and you'd be asking those guys to drive and shoot at a high rate to make up for the offense lost. it just wouldn't make sense.
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  #15  
Old 08-05-12, 06:59 PM
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Wow we are scraping the barrel hard here with looking at him or Blatche, I would rather not get another big like them and cheer on Blair and Bonner for the regular season.
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  #16  
Old 08-05-12, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kager View Post
Wow we are scraping the barrel hard here with looking at him or Blatche, I would rather not get another big like them and cheer on Blair and Bonner for the regular season.
+1
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  #17  
Old 08-05-12, 07:24 PM
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The fact that he was accused of a ridiculous crime and looking at his criminal history is enough for the spurs to stay away, whether it is or not up in the air, just isnt worth it for a garbage player. He also doesnt fit the mold of what the spurs are about on and off the court. Doesnt matter what Blair didnt do in the season because he is no better than Blair. To think Bonner will ever be released or traded is just nonsense, Pop would never let that happen.
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  #18  
Old 08-05-12, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
who cares if he can't shoot? you put him next to Blair or Splitter and there's 3-4 guys in the paint challenging us to shoot (kind of like last year) and we get tossed, but you're right, you're just comparing him to a HALL OF FAMER! that makes no sense, they don't have the same level of intensity or skill.

we can't move Bonner or Blair apparently, so we'd have to release them and go over the luxury tax. it's easy for Spurs fans to say "do it!" but there has to be stuff done to make it happen. we're not trading Bonner, if we could we would have traded him already. the same goes with Blair.

"career bench player", again he had guys in Denver who could shoot (Nene would just abuse people inside and K-Mart had a jumper there, do you think Splitter can handle a double team or bully his way to the basket?) he wouldn't work here if you'd play him next to Tiago or Blair and our defense wouldn't improve with him next to Bonner. you'd have to play him next to Duncan or Diaw, which would mean starting Splitter or Bonner or Blair. by the way this team looks right now, Pop may start Diaw which would then leave Splitter off the bench with Mills/Manu/Jackson and you'd be asking those guys to drive and shoot at a high rate to make up for the offense lost. it just wouldn't make sense.
Don't fly off the handle with Rodman. Example was shooting and being a threat on the offensive end only. Don't twist it around like the other "experts" on here. Why does everyone need to be an offensive threat??? You are making it seem this guy is playing 30 minutes a night. I'm not saying that. Who is going to block shots and challenge at the rim besides TD???? ANSWER THAT? Rip Andersen all you want at the vet min. but I'd rather have him then Blair/Bonner at 4 million dollars more then Chris. Why is everyone saying that I'm saying add Andersen with Blair and Bonner??????? They are not playing 15 guys a night anyway. I REPEAT AGAIN if they can move Blair and or Bonner go for it at vet min only for Andersen. They need long athletic players in the frontcourt. If they can't move a frontcourt piece or two........ don't do it because of luxury tax purposes. What's your solution? Status Quo will not work!
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  #19  
Old 08-06-12, 12:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL View Post
Don't fly off the handle with Rodman. Example was shooting and being a threat on the offensive end only. Don't twist it around like the other "experts" on here. Why does everyone need to be an offensive threat???
not everyone needs to be an offensive threat. you DO need an offensive threat in the paint if you have your 3rd big as a guy who can't shoot.

Basketball 101: 2 bigs who can't shoot = paint clogged up. then you'd have Tiago/Birdman shooting jumpers and guys playing Manu/Parker honest even on the pick. we'd get no where. it'd make sense if you played the guy next to Bonner (balance wise but we still wouldn't rebound or be good defensively) but you want to trade him, so with Blair/Splitter he wouldn't fit.

we'd have the Thunder play the paint and dare us to shoot and we'd miss shots, you know, like with what happened last year.
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  #20  
Old 08-06-12, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
not everyone needs to be an offensive threat. you DO need an offensive threat in the paint if you have your 3rd big as a guy who can't shoot.

Basketball 101: 2 bigs who can't shoot = paint clogged up. then you'd have Tiago/Birdman shooting jumpers and guys playing Manu/Parker honest even on the pick. we'd get no where. it'd make sense if you played the guy next to Bonner (balance wise but we still wouldn't rebound or be good defensively) but you want to trade him, so with Blair/Splitter he wouldn't fit.

we'd have the Thunder play the paint and dare us to shoot and we'd miss shots, you know, like with what happened last year.
Basketball 101? lol. Nice try. I look outside the box . Why does he have to come in with Splitter? ???? Why can't Duncan come out and Diaw stay out there? Why can't Diaw come out and TD stay out there? There is your OUTSIDE shot with TD or Diaw! You don't do total sub outs with NBA teams. Again avoiding my question........what would you do to solve the playoff losses to the Grizzlies and Thunder? The Spurs did not lose because they didn't have Andersen but coming back with the same team plus Nando De Colo does not send shockwaves to the rest of the league to include OKC. Yes you can develop Kawhi more and Joseph too. But in the end it's not going to get it done. Memphis and OKC have exposed the Spurs' lack of athletic big men. Yes Andersen is not young but he is still spry. At the vet min. with someone else being moved is a stop gap.....I know that. But having Blair who barely played and Bonner who played 2 minutes and 0 minutes in the last two games of the series tells you something right there. It's not about shooting slumps,schemes and coaching......it's about a acquiring talented frontcourt members to challenge these young athletic teams. Sometimes it comes down to ability. Again his role is not to be a savior. I want a threat above the rim on the defensive end. I'm being cost effective here too. Don't want a big who camps out on the 3 point line and chokes in the playoffs or a big who is 6-4 and sulks at not being the starter.
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  #21  
Old 08-06-12, 01:09 AM
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Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
The fact that he was accused of a ridiculous crime and looking at his criminal history is enough for the spurs to stay away, whether it is or not up in the air, just isnt worth it for a garbage player. He also doesnt fit the mold of what the spurs are about on and off the court. Doesnt matter what Blair didnt do in the season because he is no better than Blair. To think Bonner will ever be released or traded is just nonsense, Pop would never let that happen.
Stranger things have happened. Don't assume he did it. You could have someone look up things on YOUR computer or email things but who would get the blame? YOU! Fit the mold? So Stephen Jackson does? Going into the stands and punching fans! Firing a gun in a strip club parking lot? Yeah Spurs material right there! He had a crimainal past too! lol. Also there have been reports of extortion attempts versus Birdman by a deranged female fan or something of that nature. Look it up! Get over it! PLUS HE WAS NEVER ARRESTED!
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  #22  
Old 08-06-12, 01:26 AM
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The biggest problem I see was said in the Blatche thread where these two don't have the head space to follow a system, and we all know what happens then...... Pop rides you and you ride the pine.

So I can't see the Spurs going for these two who are just capable of flashes of independant ability, not getting their head around a system that tests the best of them...... they would not be cruel to them like that, I know in their position I would want to be somewhere with less pressure on following structure and more on filling the right stats.
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  #23  
Old 08-06-12, 02:01 AM
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Im not assuming he did but Im not assuming he didnt due to his history and obviously the Nuggets felt it was in their best interest to cut ties with him even if he wasnt charged, so why should the Spurs take that chance. Last I checked Jackson had no history before he joined the Spurs for the first time and during that time never had any history except a championship. To compare Jackson to Anderson is nonsense because Anderson is not half the player Jackson is.
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  #24  
Old 08-06-12, 03:40 AM
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Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
Im not assuming he did but Im not assuming he didnt due to his history and obviously the Nuggets felt it was in their best interest to cut ties with him even if he wasnt charged, so why should the Spurs take that chance. Last I checked Jackson had no history before he joined the Spurs for the first time and during that time never had any history except a championship. To compare Jackson to Anderson is nonsense because Anderson is not half the player Jackson is.
His history involved illegal drugs. Yes and he got caught but you mean to tell me these players with tons of money don't experiment with drugs at all in their entire pro basketball career? Yeah right! Take out David Robinson and Tim Duncan .....I'm sure most have even as Spurs players. I'm not comparing Jackson to Andersen as players........WTH are you bringing that up?! This is about character issues right? I'm talking about right now and the past not just the 2003 Stephen Jackson version only. The Spurs brought back Jackson with his extended rap sheet! So anything he did after he left the first time in SA does not count at all???? Silly answer. Denver amnestied Andersen mainly because of his salary and the fact they have Kenneth Faried. You got to cut payroll somewhere with big contracts on McGee and Al Harrington. Also they have a well paid Timothy Mozgov too. Also lets not forget they got Anthony Randolph and Kostas Koufos in the frontcourt fold. Where are the minutes for Andersen at 4 million bucks plus a season? Also what about the volunteer work Chris Andersen did in New Orleans when they had the big hurricane? Yeah sounds like a major scumbag to me.
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  #25  
Old 08-06-12, 04:32 AM
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You are comparing them because you are the one who brought him up. This is about Jackson who has already made his name with the team before he returned and someone who hasnt that isnt worth looking at. Like I said his first time with the Spurs was no problem till he left and when he returned he knew he had to check his problems at the door or else the team would of never made the trade so that tells you how much his past counted for. Don't forget Anderson was dismissed during the playoffs by the Nuggets because of that legal issue and if he cant receive any PT behind average bigs with the Nuggets what makes you think he will with the Spurs. His volunteer work is required by the franchise and the league so dont think this covers his image.
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  #26  
Old 08-06-12, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
You are comparing them because you are the one who brought him up. This is about Jackson who has already made his name with the team before he returned and someone who hasnt that isnt worth looking at. Like I said his first time with the Spurs was no problem till he left and when he returned he knew he had to check his problems at the door or else the team would of never made the trade so that tells you how much his past counted for. Don't forget Anderson was dismissed during the playoffs by the Nuggets because of that legal issue and if he cant receive any PT behind average bigs with the Nuggets what makes you think he will with the Spurs. His volunteer work is required by the franchise and the league so dont think this covers his image.
He did receive playing time last year during the regular season because I attended one of those when he did versus the Spurs. They dismissed him to focus on his legal issues which to this day has not led to an arrest or any type of detainment. Not all charity work is mandated by the league FYI:

Andersen has a history of helping out charities during his time in Denver and New Orleans, where he played from 2004-08. According to the Nuggets' media guide, Andersen raised money for Mount Saint Vincent, a home for troubled and abused children, and was honored at the home's 2009 Silver Bell Ball. He's also involved with Alliance for Choice in Education, which provides scholarships for low-income families to use in private schools.

So Jackson's past does not count but Andersen's does because you don't like him? Again just because Jackson won a ring that means he can do whatever he wants as far as punching people in the stands or shooting guns in public areas? The Spurs traded for Dennis Rodman. Dennis had a 12 gauge in his mouth in a Detroit parking lot and didn't the Spurs trade for him with that prior knowledge anyway? Did he check his issues at the door? You keep changing it around to your favor with all these additional variables. You just want choir boys playing? Also as stated before..........the Spurs would have to trim the bigs anyway. Why are the Spurs looking at Blatche according to reports? When would he play? Chris Andersen was set up! Look it up!
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  #27  
Old 08-06-12, 01:45 PM
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Basketball 101? lol. Nice try. I look outside the box . Why does he have to come in with Splitter? ???? Why can't Duncan come out and Diaw stay out there?
matchups. you can't go with a set rotation, especially with foul troubles.

so you'd bump Anderson as our 3rd big and bump Splitter (who's arguably all around better) to 4th big, that including not playing Bonner or Blair?

Anderson is an energy player and can't create on his own (his overall game is what RJ had: can't spot up shoot consistently, but needs someone to create for him, i.e. lobs). if one of those get into foul trouble and Anderson comes in, who exactly is gonna throw lobs for Anderson? granted as the 4th big, you can rely on Manu or De Colo doing it, but Splitter's guy would be in the paint (unless you're planning to play Diaw or Duncan for a full 1 1/2 quarters or so, which is insane).

it's ok to think outside the box (that's what Pop does for small ball and i know you're not a fan right?), but at some point you have to put basketball common sense which would say Birdman would be the 4th big in the rotation and wouldn't work with Tiago ahead of him. even if you say our defense would improve with Birdman as the 3rd/4th big, with their bigs playing the paint, you'd be forcing Ginobili to drive or shoot off the screen with absolutely no ball movement. i love Manu, but the guy can't do that without some spacing.

i'd think outside the box this way: i'd rather play Stephen Jackson as our backup PF over Birdman and sign a legit SF to backup Kawhi.
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  #28  
Old 08-06-12, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
matchups. you can't go with a set rotation, especially with foul troubles.

so you'd bump Anderson as our 3rd big and bump Splitter (who's arguably all around better) to 4th big, that including not playing Bonner or Blair?

Anderson is an energy player and can't create on his own (his overall game is what RJ had: can't spot up shoot consistently, but needs someone to create for him, i.e. lobs). if one of those get into foul trouble and Anderson comes in, who exactly is gonna throw lobs for Anderson? granted as the 4th big, you can rely on Manu or De Colo doing it, but Splitter's guy would be in the paint (unless you're planning to play Diaw or Duncan for a full 1 1/2 quarters or so, which is insane).

it's ok to think outside the box (that's what Pop does for small ball and i know you're not a fan right?), but at some point you have to put basketball common sense which would say Birdman would be the 4th big in the rotation and wouldn't work with Tiago ahead of him. even if you say our defense would improve with Birdman as the 3rd/4th big, with their bigs playing the paint, you'd be forcing Ginobili to drive or shoot off the screen with absolutely no ball movement. i love Manu, but the guy can't do that without some spacing.

i'd think outside the box this way: i'd rather play Stephen Jackson as our backup PF over Birdman and sign a legit SF to backup Kawhi.
Point taken only thing is that you are ASSUMING some of my views on this subject. I never said go with a set rotation. Notice I had some interchangable options. I never said Andersen would be the 3rd big. Yes Splitter is more talented overall. You really can't have Blair and Bonner anyway for luxury tax purposes so at least one would need to go. Which I stated that. Birdman at vet min. is not a bad deal money wise is it? Splitter is kissing 4 million and Bonner at 3.6 million. Andersen would be around 1 million. Splitter is a good passer in or out of the low box. Splitter improved from year one to year two so maybe he could improve on top of that? I think LeBron doing PF is not the same as with SJax at PF. I really don't want SJax tangling with Zach Randolph. He can handle Dirk but what about non perimeter big men? Nightmare city on defense. Jack has the height but not the weight of a LBJ. He is a fighter but using him in that capacity in that role often is totally insane. I guess TD will sit some games here and there so again I ask YOU................where is your shot blocking threat when he sits for a break or out for 48 minutes on certain back to backs????

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  #29  
Old 08-06-12, 03:53 PM
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Im not the one with additional variables, Im not the one who brought Jackson and Rodman into it. You're the one bringing up history with the pre Pop and Duncan era that have nothing to do with this and if I remember right Pop got rid of Rodman when he had the chance, so you can keep digging. Obviously Jackson's past didnt matter to the team when they traded for him and no I dont think Anderson and his past is worth the look. You want to accuse me of assuming he is guilty when you're the one assuming he was set up and who knows but that is hearsay until proven so why would you want that hanging in the air in the Spurs locker room. I would rather have a choir boy than a problem child. Not all charity is mandated but charity is mandated and what player dont have charities of their own. Spurs will find someone that can represent them in the best way possible.
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Old 08-06-12, 05:31 PM
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Point taken only thing is that you are ASSUMING some of my views on this subject. I never said go with a set rotation. Notice I had some interchangable options. I never said Andersen would be the 3rd big. Yes Splitter is more talented overall. You really can't have Blair and Bonner anyway for luxury tax purposes so at least one would need to go. Which I stated that. Birdman at vet min. is not a bad deal money wise is it? Splitter is kissing 4 million and Bonner at 3.6 million. Andersen would be around 1 million. Splitter is a good passer in or out of the low box. Splitter improved from year one to year two so maybe he could improve on top of that? I think LeBron doing PF is not the same as with SJax at PF. I really don't want SJax tangling with Zach Randolph. He can handle Dirk but what about non perimeter big men? Nightmare city on defense. Jack has the height but not the weight of a LBJ. He is a fighter but using him in that capacity in that role often is totally insane. I guess TD will sit some games here and there so again I ask YOU................where is your shot blocking threat when he sits for a break or out for 48 minutes on certain back to backs????
shot blocking is being way overrated on this board by some. with additions like a Birdman, you're putting way too much emphasis on shot blocking over rebounding and man defense. yes the guy will try to block just about every shot he'll see and probably miss the majority of those blocked shots by being antsy and falling for pump fakes.

at this point, you should be concerned with rebounding and defense. we've won championships without shot blocking (05, 07), we just haven't played defense well.

give me a legit 6'10"-7 footer guy who can defend, rebound, & rotate on defense and that'll make up for anything Birdman can do already (if he's not available, then getting someone just because isn't going to help). he's overrated. if he wasn't, then he wouldn't be a free agent right now.

the NBA Finals only had ONE legit shot blocker and he seemed to be in foul trouble when it got close. other than Ibaka, the Thunder had no real shot blocker after him and the Heat didn't have a shot blocker in the paint. if we could have enough defensive players with a defensive mindset, we would've beaten the Thunder. everyone sucked, including Danny Green forgetting to actually D up Thefolosha. if you think shot blocking is our ultimate need enough to give up the other sides of the defensive end, you're mistaken.

btw "interchangeable rotations" are only legit when you have versatile players involved who can do about the same stuff and make up for what the other can do. you won't have that with one dimensional players at the end of our bench, especially since their achilles heel is the same thing. you can't interchange the starting rotation right away anyway unless it's a guy spotting another (i.e. when guys would spot Horry). we're starting our 2 best bigs right now with Duncan/Diaw, you can't do that with Splitter or Birdman.
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Old 08-06-12, 10:19 PM
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Im not the one with additional variables, Im not the one who brought Jackson and Rodman into it. You're the one bringing up history with the pre Pop and Duncan era that have nothing to do with this and if I remember right Pop got rid of Rodman when he had the chance, so you can keep digging. Obviously Jackson's past didnt matter to the team when they traded for him and no I dont think Anderson and his past is worth the look. You want to accuse me of assuming he is guilty when you're the one assuming he was set up and who knows but that is hearsay until proven so why would you want that hanging in the air in the Spurs locker room. I would rather have a choir boy than a problem child. Not all charity is mandated but charity is mandated and what player dont have charities of their own. Spurs will find someone that can represent them in the best way possible.
I brought them up once again ONLY for their characters not their court play! The Spurs had the super clean image thing Pre-Pop or Post Pop already did they not? The NBA has not stepped down on Andersen or have him suspended or banned him have they? Don't want choir boys versus thugs? Okay fine. I'd rather have Rodman over Charles Smith, Carl Herrera, Brad Lohaus and Greg Anderson. That was the post Pop power forwards after he was traded. Than they landed Duncan by luck alone. That saved their butts! Also what happened to all the RJ lovers? Yeah Jackson the anti-Spur showed up with cojones! Where is RJ now? Counting his money in GS! No digging needed the facts are right there. Also if that was all hearsay why is Andersen not locked up like all the others who do that stuff? He never posted bail because he was NEVER arrested!
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  #32  
Old 08-06-12, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
shot blocking is being way overrated on this board by some. with additions like a Birdman, you're putting way too much emphasis on shot blocking over rebounding and man defense. yes the guy will try to block just about every shot he'll see and probably miss the majority of those blocked shots by being antsy and falling for pump fakes.

at this point, you should be concerned with rebounding and defense. we've won championships without shot blocking (05, 07), we just haven't played defense well.

give me a legit 6'10"-7 footer guy who can defend, rebound, & rotate on defense and that'll make up for anything Birdman can do already (if he's not available, then getting someone just because isn't going to help). he's overrated. if he wasn't, then he wouldn't be a free agent right now.

the NBA Finals only had ONE legit shot blocker and he seemed to be in foul trouble when it got close. other than Ibaka, the Thunder had no real shot blocker after him and the Heat didn't have a shot blocker in the paint. if we could have enough defensive players with a defensive mindset, we would've beaten the Thunder. everyone sucked, including Danny Green forgetting to actually D up Thefolosha. if you think shot blocking is our ultimate need enough to give up the other sides of the defensive end, you're mistaken.

btw "interchangeable rotations" are only legit when you have versatile players involved who can do about the same stuff and make up for what the other can do. you won't have that with one dimensional players at the end of our bench, especially since their achilles heel is the same thing. you can't interchange the starting rotation right away anyway unless it's a guy spotting another (i.e. when guys would spot Horry). we're starting our 2 best bigs right now with Duncan/Diaw, you can't do that with Splitter or Birdman.
okay that all sounds fair and good but this garbage about that's why he is available........why was Scola available? Sometimes its not about the play on the court but the contract. Incident or not........Birdman was going to get amnestied either way YOU know that. I agree with the one dimensional players but some of those one dimentional players make way more then vet.min..........so is Bonner 4 times better then Birdman? I think not. Didn't win with shot blocking in 05' and 07'? Isn't Duncan top 10 in all time blocks? Robert Horry was a great WEAKSIDE shot blocker. Nazr averaged one shot block a game in the 05' playoffs! That's a shot blocker threat last time I checked.
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Old 08-06-12, 11:06 PM
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Bonner is 4 times better than Birdman because he has the ability to follow the complex sets on D and Offence that Pop is using to make us a threat to teams with more talent on paper.....

I can not see Birdman following even the defensive set forget the offensive requirements in the picknroll motion. Pop will give hive limited minutes in some games before deciding that he is not worth it and will go to players that can do what is required rather than just get block stats at the risk of the rest of the team.

Then your investment is at the end of the bench for the whole season rather than just the finals and will become your new trade target.
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  #34  
Old 08-07-12, 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Kager View Post
Bonner is 4 times better than Birdman because he has the ability to follow the complex sets on D and Offence that Pop is using to make us a threat to teams with more talent on paper.....

I can not see Birdman following even the defensive set forget the offensive requirements in the picknroll motion. Pop will give hive limited minutes in some games before deciding that he is not worth it and will go to players that can do what is required rather than just get block stats at the risk of the rest of the team.

Then your investment is at the end of the bench for the whole season rather than just the finals and will become your new trade target.
Bonner four times better? A drug screen is needed for you........lol
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  #35  
Old 08-07-12, 02:24 AM
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The Spurs did have a clean image pre pop with the admiral in the center of it all but it was never as tight as it is now and that's due to players and management. I dont see why anyone would think of Jackson as the "anti-spur" because he would have never been with the Spurs if he was one so that makes no sense and he never did anything to the Spurs to make him one. All the Spurs did was trade off one for the other when they traded RJ for Jackson mainly for cap reasons and the team also felt like they were missing something too. The NBA has gone to great lengths to completely remove Anderson from their site and they wouldn't take those steps if there was nothing to it. If the NBA dont even want this guy in the league what makes you think the Spurs do. His career could easily be over period! No question Bonner is more fit for this team than Anderson.
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  #36  
Old 08-07-12, 05:15 AM
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Not a fit.
Not a character guy.
Overly eccentric, distracting.
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  #37  
Old 08-07-12, 05:42 AM
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We can not find better for veteran minimum.

Moreover this guy is an energizer guy which we need last year's play-off against Thunder.

I say yes to him.
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Old 08-07-12, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kager View Post
Bonner is 4 times better than Birdman because he has the ability to follow the complex sets on D and Offence that Pop is using to make us a threat to teams with more talent on paper.....

I can not see Birdman following even the defensive set forget the offensive requirements in the picknroll motion. Pop will give hive limited minutes in some games before deciding that he is not worth it and will go to players that can do what is required rather than just get block stats at the risk of the rest of the team.

Then your investment is at the end of the bench for the whole season rather than just the finals and will become your new trade target.
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  #39  
Old 08-07-12, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
The Spurs did have a clean image pre pop with the admiral in the center of it all but it was never as tight as it is now and that's due to players and management. I dont see why anyone would think of Jackson as the "anti-spur" because he would have never been with the Spurs if he was one so that makes no sense and he never did anything to the Spurs to make him one. All the Spurs did was trade off one for the other when they traded RJ for Jackson mainly for cap reasons and the team also felt like they were missing something too. The NBA has gone to great lengths to completely remove Anderson from their site and they wouldn't take those steps if there was nothing to it. If the NBA dont even want this guy in the league what makes you think the Spurs do. His career could easily be over period! No question Bonner is more fit for this team than Anderson.
FYI he called himself the "anti spur" back in his first tenure with them. Yes it was a cap trade and I even said that but RJ sucked. That was a huge factor. Also an emerging Kawhi too.

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  #40  
Old 08-07-12, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL View Post
Nazr averaged one shot block a game in the 05' playoffs! That's a shot blocker threat last time I checked.
you mean the guy who only played well during one game of the Seattle series and just spotted Horry minutes? oh yeah, sorry he had that one huge (not really) block on Ben Wallace trying a turn around layup.

Duncan's been our shot blocker, Horry blocked a few shots every now and then.

my point is shot blocking was never a necessity, only a luxury with those guys. we never got shot blockers over defense/rebounding. Birdman would give us a liability on defense every time he'd jump for a block.

also take in the fact he was fat and out of shape. he's such a steal no one wants him right?
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Old 08-07-12, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Kager View Post
Bonner is 4 times better than Birdman because he has the ability to follow the complex sets on D and Offence that Pop is using to make us a threat to teams with more talent on paper.....

I can not see Birdman following even the defensive set forget the offensive requirements in the picknroll motion. Pop will give hive limited minutes in some games before deciding that he is not worth it and will go to players that can do what is required rather than just get block stats at the risk of the rest of the team.

Then your investment is at the end of the bench for the whole season rather than just the finals and will become your new trade target.
i'm gonna totally agree with Kager on Bonner. Bonner is at least good at ONE thing (albeit during the regular season). Birdman is below average at just about everything.

the reason why Pop has gone with Bonner over an actual defensive big next to Duncan is because you can always rotate guys for a defensive scheme to make up for something, even if it takes a lot out of the team. with someone like Birdman, you'd have to ask Pop to now become an offensive genius and somehow try to make our guys pure shooters because that's all the offense we'd have. no doubt we'd have wide open jumpers because there would be screens set up on the top of the key but with a guy waiting in the paint, that's all we'd have. unless Ginobili can come up with funky drives like he did vs. the Lakers in 2004 (you remember that right? when Rasho/Hedo couldn't shoot so they had 3-4 guys in the paint waiting or last year when OKC did the same thing) or somehow Parker re-gaining some of his speed from 10 years ago, it won't help us any.
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  #42  
Old 08-07-12, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
you mean the guy who only played well during one game of the Seattle series and just spotted Horry minutes? oh yeah, sorry he had that one huge (not really) block on Ben Wallace trying a turn around layup.

Duncan's been our shot blocker, Horry blocked a few shots every now and then.

my point is shot blocking was never a necessity, only a luxury with those guys. we never got shot blockers over defense/rebounding. Birdman would give us a liability on defense every time he'd jump for a block.

also take in the fact he was fat and out of shape. he's such a steal no one wants him right?
Yeah the same guy who battled the Pistons under the hoop in the 05' Finals? What did Pop play that series like seven guys mainly? Nazr earned his ring unlike your Rasho lol. So now you admit they had shot blocking?What about altering shots? What about an intimidating presense under the basket? Not something that shows up on the stat sheet. I was not referring to just only shot blocking? Birdman sets way better picks then Bonner sorry. Also to notice not everyone agrees with you or myself on this subject so it looks 50-50 on the Birdman debate at least on this board. Fat and out of shape? Birdman versus Bonner in a athletic challenge............who wins? Thought so

Last edited by WILLTHETHRILL; 08-07-12 at 01:58 PM.
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  #43  
Old 08-07-12, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius View Post
i'm gonna totally agree with Kager on Bonner. Bonner is at least good at ONE thing (albeit during the regular season). Birdman is below average at just about everything.

the reason why Pop has gone with Bonner over an actual defensive big next to Duncan is because you can always rotate guys for a defensive scheme to make up for something, even if it takes a lot out of the team. with someone like Birdman, you'd have to ask Pop to now become an offensive genius and somehow try to make our guys pure shooters because that's all the offense we'd have. no doubt we'd have wide open jumpers because there would be screens set up on the top of the key but with a guy waiting in the paint, that's all we'd have. unless Ginobili can come up with funky drives like he did vs. the Lakers in 2004 (you remember that right? when Rasho/Hedo couldn't shoot so they had 3-4 guys in the paint waiting or last year when OKC did the same thing) or somehow Parker re-gaining some of his speed from 10 years ago, it won't help us any.
I thought Bonner sat down the entire time in the last playoff game? What did he play the game before 2 minutes? What good is that at 3.6 million per?
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  #44  
Old 08-07-12, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by td4mvp2k View Post
The Spurs did have a clean image pre pop with the admiral in the center of it all but it was never as tight as it is now and that's due to players and management. I dont see why anyone would think of Jackson as the "anti-spur" because he would have never been with the Spurs if he was one so that makes no sense and he never did anything to the Spurs to make him one. All the Spurs did was trade off one for the other when they traded RJ for Jackson mainly for cap reasons and the team also felt like they were missing something too. The NBA has gone to great lengths to completely remove Anderson from their site and they wouldn't take those steps if there was nothing to it. If the NBA dont even want this guy in the league what makes you think the Spurs do. His career could easily be over period! No question Bonner is more fit for this team than Anderson.
READ THIS CAREFULLY AND SLOWLY! LOOK UP THE FACTS FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FYI if you go to the NBA's current website today.........Chris Andersen still has an active profile, highlight videos, and still a link to order his Denver jersey! So do some fact finding for once before typing stuff that is totally false.Your word is not gospel around here with your 20 total posts. People might disagree with me on here but they know I don't post lies and false claims on here. You either said that without checking it out and making it up or lied to people on here to add more muscle to your above post.
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  #45  
Old 08-07-12, 04:34 PM
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Whether Jackson said he was or not makes no difference because it still makes no sense and you can blame yourself and the media for buying into that too. Like I said the NBA is looking to completely remove Anderson from their site and anything associated with him when all the facts are in pending or not so go take a better look at what the NBA has planned before you start getting ahead of yourself genius...You can quit dreaming about it because he will never be a Spur in this life time. You can stick to your petty accusations because unlike you I dont need to lie and I dont need yours or anyone's word for it, It's funny to me that you think my 20 posts is not gospel..But it looks like you do think it is otherwise you wouldnt have so many replies to what I post genius...That's great if you think everyone on here thinks of you as the speaker of truth and president of the board but not me so Im sorry I had to expose you in front of all your followers with my 20 posts and all...But you've already proven my point so thank you. You can also do me and yourself a favor and go order that clown's jersey.
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  #46  
Old 08-07-12, 04:42 PM
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I thought Bonner sat down the entire time in the last playoff game? What did he play the game before 2 minutes? What good is that at 3.6 million per?
you forgot to read the "albeit in the regular season" part, but it's ok

yes Will, the guy who played 23mpg in the NBA Finals, who battled under the basket vs. the Pistons, and was our starting center.

the problem with your analogy? he was our STARTING CENTER. you're talking about bringing in a guy who won't get close to that many minutes and will be our FOURTH big.

Diaw will get around 30mpg, Duncan will get around 25mpg, Splitter will get around 20mpg, whatever your boy will be getting wouldn't be a factor in there during crunch time or early on. that's why last year (to actually prove your point wrong with your own point) Bonner got little to no minutes and he was our....wait for it....FOURTH big, just like you want Chris Anderson to be. if he's not going to get minutes or valuable minutes, there's no point in bringing in someone just because you hate Matt Bonner and won't improve the team.
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  #47  
Old 08-07-12, 05:33 PM
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I guess you could add in the relevant facts that salary is actually based on regular season performance. And, given that the Spurs earned the #1 seed in the West, regular season performance versus equity turned out all right.

How'd all those big minute players do against the Thunder?
Lost? Yup.

But I guess the big dollar/loss numbers fade against the role player/loss numbers.

By gawd, with 15 players, scapegoats abound! Or maybe, the Thunder were better. Kinda like 4 losses in a row might imply.
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  #48  
Old 08-07-12, 05:51 PM
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you forgot to read the "albeit in the regular season" part, but it's ok

yes Will, the guy who played 23mpg in the NBA Finals, who battled under the basket vs. the Pistons, and was our starting center.

the problem with your analogy? he was our STARTING CENTER. you're talking about bringing in a guy who won't get close to that many minutes and will be our FOURTH big.

Diaw will get around 30mpg, Duncan will get around 25mpg, Splitter will get around 20mpg, whatever your boy will be getting wouldn't be a factor in there during crunch time or early on. that's why last year (to actually prove your point wrong with your own point) Bonner got little to no minutes and he was our....wait for it....FOURTH big, just like you want Chris Anderson to be. if he's not going to get minutes or valuable minutes, there's no point in bringing in someone just because you hate Matt Bonner and won't improve the team.
no full reply to my post just a statement post with a little piece of my post to hide my points.......nice
Nazr was a starter? I thought Nazr was just to cover some minutes for Horry?Playing half a game is not considered a contribution? You tried to trash my point with ignoring the reason I brought up Nazr on your they had no shot blocking claim with him/TD/Horry! I thought the Spurs had none?lol I guess that's why you did a statement versus a reply. Want to change your answer? Let's move on. Wouldn't matter if I liked Bonner or not he sucks in the playoffs plain and simple! How many chances has he had as a playoff starter or bench player? Enough is enough with him! Again Birdman would not be paid 3.6 million! He would only get vet min. and you want Bonner at that figure? Yeah not everyone played but Bonner is making too much to sit down. Look at the money! You don't like Bonner either I thought?? Well it's because I'm involved so I guess you joined the "Matt Bonner Lover Club". But I guess you want a stretch four at all costs even if the red head makes 3.9 million the following year to shoot bricks when he does play in the playoffs? As a fourth big you don't pay guys that high to sit down unless in certain cases there is a good reason why. Or if you are the Lakers or Heat who pay 10 million plus in luxury tax fees every year! It's not my money or yours so it's simple to say pay him and keep him and trade for him BUT WE DON'T PAY THE PLAYERS DIRECTLY! So you want a guy who at three point whatever million to sit down for 46-48 minutes in a playoff game? Do you? You might very well sit Birdman down too at times but look at the paycheck........which stings more? Bonner's check does. I don't think Birdman has a rep as a playoff goat every year like Bonner has does he? Every year it's the same thing with Bonner. Spurs might win the regular season crown with Matt Bonner but in the end you need men who have big b*lls to perform on the next level. Reducing the amount of those guys is an addition to me not a subtraction to the team. Get rid of Bonner already. Give someone else a chance IN THE PLAYOFFS. Birdman>Bonner.
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Old 08-07-12, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katyspursfan View Post
I guess you could add in the relevant facts that salary is actually based on regular season performance. And, given that the Spurs earned the #1 seed in the West, regular season performance versus equity turned out all right.

How'd all those big minute players do against the Thunder?
Lost? Yup.

But I guess the big dollar/loss numbers fade against the role player/loss numbers.

By gawd, with 15 players, scapegoats abound! Or maybe, the Thunder were better. Kinda like 4 losses in a row might imply.
So why did Jaren Jackson get a huge pay bump after the 99' championship? Oh yeah the playoffs........
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Old 08-07-12, 06:05 PM
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Moments like this when I ALMOST un-ignore Will.

But when I do, I always think "Meh, why did I do this?? He's not that bright."

Will-power! (for the ultimate irony!)
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