|
 |
|
#1
06-22-12, 02:01 PM
| ||||
| ||||
So i have been looking at all these trade suggestions and free agency ideas and while bearing in mind that the spurs arent usually big movers and shakers I have been wondering what the roster would probably be like next year... In my opinion these guys are coming back... Tony Parker Manu Leonard Diaw (I think he is just too good of an offensive fit for us to let go. He may cost us more then we would like but i think we resign him. he will be even better with a full offseason with us) Duncan joseph (we drafted him for his potential, not his current ability.) neal (he is a good spark off the bench. not a backup pg, but an eddie house type guy) jackson Lorbek(ok, not coming back but coming over) tiago This means one way or another we are getting rid of and will need to replace... Blair (trade) Bonner (trade) Mills (he walks) Anderson (he walks) Green (sign and trade hopefully. We may end up keeping green, I think it depends on how they think nando has progressed) I think lorbek replaces and is an improvement over bonner. I think if Joseph improves enough to play backup pg then the combination of him and neal make mills expendable. Andersoon is simply replaced at the end of the bench by neal or joseph who was inactive last season. I believe we package blair, bonner and green in order to get into the early 2nd or late 1st round of the draft. We would also need to bring over another Euro player, possibly decolo to replace greens niche. That would leave us with one remaining roster spot for a free agent or an undrafted guy... Im not one of you salary cap guru's so this may all be incredibly impossible under our current cap but It seems feasible. that leaves us with a roster looking something like this... parker, joseph manu, decolo, neal Leonard, jackson, Diaw, lorbek, duncan, splitter a late 1st/early 2nd round draft pick and a free agent Now on to my real question, and obviously a lot would depend on who the draft pick and the free agent are, but if this is our roster going into next year, is it enough? are the few changes made enough to get us another ring? is that lineup even better than the one we had this year?      |
|
#2
06-22-12, 02:06 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
I agree with your projected lineup. I think it is almost enough, but not quite. I think Lorbek will be great, but he will not provide what we are missing. What we are missing is Kawhi Leonard at the PF/C spot. If we were able to trade the guys you mentioned (and maybe even Splitter) to get a PF/C who was long enough to protect the rim, yet athletic enough to guard the pick and roll, we would be set.
__________________ Dejuan Blair is worse than Matt Bonner! |
|
#3
06-22-12, 02:34 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
I agree we need a Kawhi type at the 4 or 5. That is certainly in an ideal world but i dont really want to give up on splitter to get him. I think green blair and bonner would be enough to get us a pick,and then depending how we go in the draft we fill out the roster with a cheap to moderate FA... but I also agree that the roster is lacking length, and athleticism at the 4/5 spot.
|
|
#4
06-22-12, 03:16 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
So, with the MLE, you are going to pay Diaw, Lorbek, De Colo, and a free agent. And still have a couple roster spots to fill. Bonner and Blair will both most likely be back. If we want to be honest about the roster. |
|
#5
06-22-12, 05:51 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
__________________  |
|
#6
06-22-12, 06:35 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Rules be dammed, spend that money! |
|
#7
06-22-12, 06:45 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Danny Greens contract is affordable but he is a rfa. The Celtics seem to interested in acquiring him. Instead of renewing his contract, why not trade him for #21-22 draft picks? With Lorbek coming over, why do we need Bonner? He should be made part of a trade for the first round. Splitter rightly is one of the question marks. Why not trade him for a high ist round draft? Add some players to sweeten the pot and trade to the Bobcats or the Raptors or one of the teams with multiple 1st round draft picks. Blair would an attractive trade bait for a high 2nd round draft pick. Talks seem to point that the Spurs are interested in O'Quinn or Sims or Tony Wroten if available to compensate for the loss of Mills. And finally, Jackson. No doubt that he was one of the better acquisitions but his contract is ridiculously very high. Unless he is willing to have his salary restructured, he should be traded if there are teams willing to take him. His current take is $10m. This is too much. Maybe he should be sent to the Hawks for a draft pick with a salary of say $2m. Just to sweeten the pot, add some players in the deal. The Spurs stand to save $8m enough to join the free agency. Send Joseph to the Magic if deColo is coming over for Daniel Orton, a player rarely used.
Last edited by Wesley33177; 06-22-12 at 06:47 PM. |
|
#8
06-22-12, 06:49 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#9
06-22-12, 08:36 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Pop won't get rid of splitter...then, again, I didn't think he would trade Hill, either
|
|
#10
06-22-12, 09:19 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
What im afraid of is Pop wanting to keep Bonner instead of Splitter.  |
|
#11
06-22-12, 10:07 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
I only advocate getting rid of Splitter if you are getting that K. Leonard type in return.
__________________ Dejuan Blair is worse than Matt Bonner! |
|
#12
06-23-12, 07:52 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Hill had more value than Splitter has now. Hill was also thought to be the missing piece for IND. And it still didn't draw a lottery pick. Bonner, for all his playoff faults, is still valuable during the regular season. No coach coming through Texas develops a game plan to stop Bonner on a Tuesday night game. Not with Tony, Timmy and Manu also on the floor. And with Dirk Wednesday. So Bonner gets his shot off. |
|
#13
06-23-12, 08:57 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
If this doesn't tell pop to get rid of him nothing will. Lorbek can come over and shoot and post up point guards. Stephen jackson can play the 4 and shoot 3's and post up point guards. Quit making damn excuses for bonner. Who cars if he his a couple threes in january. |
|
#14
06-23-12, 09:26 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
the man said regular season....and he's right no plans for bonner in the reg season, playoffs when you see the same team over and over is another story... |
|
#15
06-23-12, 09:32 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#16
06-23-12, 06:19 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Spurs thrive on the three pointer. Parker doesn't have near the season he had if the Spurs aren't hitting from the outside. One of the reasons the Spurs have this game plan is because of Bonner, Leonard, et al. Don't ignore the fact that Bonner is a top shooter in the league. |
|
#17
06-23-12, 06:37 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Bonner 11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs I rest my case.......... |
|
#18
06-23-12, 06:46 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#19
06-23-12, 07:08 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Bonner plays a roll in the grand scheme of things, nothing more, nothing less.
|
|
#20
06-23-12, 07:43 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#21
06-23-12, 08:19 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#22
06-23-12, 09:49 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#23
06-23-12, 10:40 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Bonner 11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs I rest my case.......... |
|
#24
06-23-12, 11:48 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Lots of guys we want o keep no showed vs okc.
|
|
#25
06-24-12, 12:21 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
__________________ “The [Navy] specs called for Mach 2.34. We actually tested the airplane for Mach 2.5. I flew it 2.5 a couple times. When you fly a Phantom, it’s built for 2.0, but when you fly that fast you know it. It’s like sitting on a beach ball; you don’t know which way it’ll go, it’s so sensitive. In a F-14 it’s like sitting in a Cadillac. It’s solid. You don’t realize you’re going that fast. |
|
#26
06-24-12, 12:24 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Quote:
__________________ “The [Navy] specs called for Mach 2.34. We actually tested the airplane for Mach 2.5. I flew it 2.5 a couple times. When you fly a Phantom, it’s built for 2.0, but when you fly that fast you know it. It’s like sitting on a beach ball; you don’t know which way it’ll go, it’s so sensitive. In a F-14 it’s like sitting in a Cadillac. It’s solid. You don’t realize you’re going that fast. |
|
#27
06-24-12, 03:17 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
As for Bonner, can you honestly tell me that he can perform better in playoffs? |
|
#28
06-24-12, 07:26 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
There are 14 teams that would have loved to have made the playoffs. One of those teams hasn't seen the playoffs in 3 years, even though it's led by one Luis Scola. There are another dozen that would have loved to have participated in the conference finals. Like the defending champs. Or the entitled Lakers. How about a little appreciation for what the Spurs accomplished? |
|
#29
06-24-12, 07:30 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Why use analysis when you have an easy scapegoat already available? |
|
#30
06-24-12, 02:55 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs Suck on it! |
|
#31
06-24-12, 02:56 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Suck it! |
|
#32
06-24-12, 05:37 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
 I was debating on Bonner's value to the team. As a matter of fact, there are some truth in it, and it is the sad part. If an one-dimensional three point shooter is the important fact for Spurs to get to the top seed and yet the same player can't be depended on AT ALL in playoffs then there's a system problem. In the past, Spurs might be able to get around this because Spurs had players who could step up in big games and/or Spurs had stingy defense to fall back to. Now that Spurs had neither so this 'value' is simple fool's gold. For a while, I was quite annoyed with Bonner because I watched his shoot release on TV and I realized that a 6'0" guard can easily defend his three point shooting. Then I accepted the fact that he's what he is: he will never perform consistently in the playoffs due to his limitations. Actually, after reading some articles on him that I started to like him as a person. As a matter of fact, I don't want to get rid of him just to get rid of him. It's not a wise business plan. I just think his value to make Pop's offensive plan easier in the regular seasons as some forum members observed has already gone beyond its expiry date for a number of years. |
|
#33
06-24-12, 06:41 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Point taken. But until the blame is spread, there is no reason to believe that it will expand beyond Bonner. There are those that blame the loss on a two minute stretch of a game long ago. And the same people point out that Bonner didn't even play in later games. So the Spurs' loss can be blamed on both the presence of the Red Rocket, and his absence. Only here can one man have such an impact on the game, regardless of whether he plays or not. As for his release, it is what it is. It's one of the top shooting strokes for the entire regular season. And easily stopped in a 7 game series. Last edited by katyspursfan; 06-24-12 at 06:43 PM. |
|
#34
06-24-12, 06:47 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Bonner 11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs |
|
#35
06-25-12, 01:44 AM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Wow, I'm gone for a week and this place blows up, mostly over Bonner. I'm kind of known as a Bonner apologist, but I realize that he faded in the end. I'm also a smart person. And I realize that most of the role players faded in the end. I'm also a realist. And I realize that the reason the Spurs lost was because OKC had the better stars. It wasn't their role players that kept making clutch shots in the last minutes of the 4th quarters. It was Durant, Harden, and sometimes Westbrook. And it was James, Wade and sometimes Bosh that won the championship. So the fools can keep thinking that all the Spurs need to do is trade some role player or two for another role player. But the fact is, the Spurs have no one to depend on to hit those late heroic shots. We all thought Manu, when healthy, could do it (although I was the only who was skeptical). But he can't even do it two games in a row, much less 4 playoff series. This team will continue to break our hearts until Tim and Manu retire, or they bring in (or draft) another all star.
|
|
#36
06-25-12, 10:56 AM
| ||||
| ||||
|
I just have to give up and laugh at all those who think that the solution to our problems is ditching a role player and getting another one.
|
|
#37
06-25-12, 11:09 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Bonner is awesome! He can't even post up a point guard. Let's keep him. |
|
#38
06-25-12, 11:12 AM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Bonner 11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs |
|
#39
06-25-12, 11:25 AM
| ||||
| ||||
|
You are missing the entire point. Dump Bonner, trade him, waive him, whatever. Who takes his place? What makes you think that player, that apparently we are going to get either off the free agent dump heap or at the end of the second round, is going to make outside shots in the advanced playoff rounds (which Danny Green, Gary Neal, & Boris Diaw couldn't do), make big plays when it counts (which the big 3 couldn't do), and not make mistakes (which kept Blair, Diaw, and Splitter off the floor). THAT is the issue. Not does Matt Bonner's % drop in the playoffs. But who you gonna get to replace him? And how does this make us a better team? |
|
#40
06-25-12, 12:11 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
Westbrook was guarding stand still bonner. Allowing sefalosha to take parker and also slowing westbrook to rest on defense for offense. If bonner can't even attempt to post him up, then it is time and your stand still approach is over. There are always options when dealing with role players. Don't act like we are between a rock and a hard place in this situation. |
|
#41
06-25-12, 12:23 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Ryan Anderson is just out of reach. I don't see a scenario where we could get him. Am I missing something? That has nothing to do with Bonner unless you can figure out a way plausibly it could happen. If we could get a draft pick in the 17-25 range for Bonner, I'd probably do it. That could get us, like you mention, Royce White. Or Perry Jones, Quincy Miller, Fab Melo, Jared Sullinger. A few guys on that short list with shooting range, all have some size/length, some low-post banging potential and shotblocking. Take your pick. I'm not against that, just don't think Bonner buys you a first rounder in that area (since it took a guy of George Hill's caliber to get us into the mid-first round of a worse draft). Personally I would prefer to keep Bonner as a mistake-free player with a specialty skill set and dump Blair, whose primary weapon is his rebounding but his rebounding rate plummeted last season. Rashard Lewis I would take, but why then does it mean we have to get rid of Bonner? You need guys to fill out a roster, and while I don't want to count on Bonner to make big shots in the playoffs, I like him as a guy you can put out there who won't screw things up by making boneheaded plays (which you can't say about Blair) and who will be guaranteed to play hard on both sides of the ball. It's a long season. We need if not Bonner, guys like Bonner we can count on for the long grind, not just guys who are clutch. |
|
#42
06-25-12, 12:29 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#43
06-25-12, 12:29 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Bonner 11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs The Facts!!!!!!!!! |
|
#44
06-25-12, 12:40 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
So we just ignore the fact that we have a guy with a unique specialty who commands just $3.6mil a year, is a great locker room guy, doesn't whine about anything ever (unless they put too much tabasco on his hoagie maybe), plays underrated man to man defense, can be counted on to play the same intensity every night, is reliably healthy so the team can reduce Tim's minutes during the regular season, and doesn't do anything stupid either on or off court? That's worth nothing? |
|
#45
06-25-12, 12:43 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
 Answer the questions! |
|
#46
06-25-12, 12:44 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
Bonner 11% FG% WCF 14% 3 point FG% WCF 31% FG% 2012 playoffs 34% 3 point FG% 2012 playoffs What 3.6 million bucks buys you in the playoffs!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
|
#47
06-25-12, 12:46 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#48
06-25-12, 12:46 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
|
#49
06-25-12, 12:52 PM
| ||||
| ||||
|
At the risk of repeating myself, there are two different issues. One is who do you want in your tight rotation in the latter stages of the playoffs. I don't see Matt Bonner there and I've said that for years. The other question is who do you want filling out your roster and getting regular season minutes. Matt Bonner can have a good place there. The fact that we had to play Bonner shows us Pop's desperation. Splitter was making too many defensive mistakes. Blair is a known wildcard who makes mistakes by the truckload but can singlehandedly turn a game around, but Pop wasn't willing to take the risk (other than for like a half a game I think). Bonner doesn't screw things up. In other words, playing Bonner is the symptom of a problem on our roster, not the problem itself, because you and I and Pop all know Bonner's limitations going in. Pop was forced to play him in hopes that Bonner would play good enough mistake-free, unspectacular defense and stretch the offensive floor enough to enable other guys to win for us. I think, and Pop does too, it's good to have guys on your team who you can count on to at least not lose the game for you by yourself (see Udrih, Beno). You want to replace him in the rotation, great. No problem. But the question is always, with who? The Spurs tried out plenty of guys in the preseason and regular season and it's just hard to get a guy who's not most of the following: unathletic, no offensive moves, no outside shot, undersized, bad attitude, stupid, injury prone. With backup big men, it's always a question of the least bad option. That's why I don't begrudge this team keeping Matt. |
|
#50
06-25-12, 12:54 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Quote:
|
Linear Mode
