Duncan Signing For Less? Lebron or Wade in 2014 as a Spur?

[gosaspurs2150]

Do you think Duncan should sign for less? He made $21.5 million last year. I don't think the Spurs or any other team would offer Duncan $21.5 million for the next season or two. I do believe Duncan will be signing for less. Depending on labor union terms in regards to contracts, I think Duncan will sign for a 2 year extension for $13-14 million playing the 2012-2013 and 2013-2014 season with the Spurs and will then retire. After next season I think the Spurs will sign Ginobili for 1 more year, and will retire. So Duncan and Ginobili have two years left. I don't see Ginobili signing elsewhere after next season. I think he will go for one more year, and call it quits. Ginboli will be 36 then and Duncan 38.

So with Ginobili and Duncan off the books, for the 2014-2015 season, this means we will have a ton of cap room for the 2014 free agent market. I think maybe around $28 million to spend. The Spurs could land Lebron James or Dwayne Wade. Lebron would be 30 years old then, and Wade at 33 years old. I say go for Lebron James then at 30 years old, and we could also sign another really good free agent or player at that time too.

If Duncan reduces his salary to $13-$14 million for the next two seasons, I feel the Spurs could sign a quality PF/C in the free agent market this year. I think Roy Hibbert will demand too much money, and feel he is slightly overrated. He will be offered about $10-$11 million. No thanks. It appears Dallas is making a serious push for Hibbert.

I feel the Spurs should heavily look at Jason Thompson of the Sacramento Kings or Ryan Anderson of the Orlando Magic. Both would demand roughly $7-$8 million a year. If we could sign one of those two players, I think Blair would be gone. This means the only two players gone from the Spurs this season would be James Anderson and Dejuan Blair. But who knows, the Spurs might sign Blair for a few years for cheap. Maybe 2 years at $5.5 million? I think we should sign Green and Mills each for 2 years at $2.5 to $3 million per year.

I think though we should match the Kings offer for Thompson. I wouldn't mind at all the Spurs signing him for 3-4 years at $7.5 million. The guy is 6'11'', athletic, can rebound, can shoot well from the outside, and can rotate pretty well on defenders. I like him a lot. And he is only 25.

I see the very solid starting and back up line up being next season:

Starters:
Parker/Duncan/Leonard/Diaw/Jackson

Bench:
Jason Thompson or Ryan Anderson/Splitter/Neal/Mills/Diaw/Ginobili/Bonner

Others (12-14 spots):
Lorbeck and de Colo or any D-League Toros potential players or unpicked free agents.

With this rotation and line up, depending on pretty solid health, the Spurs would be either a 1 to 4 seed next season and likely competing against the Thunder for the WCF next year again.

With the long 82 game season next year, I can see Duncan and Ginobili only playing 24 minutes a game with Parker playing 28 minutes and Duncan and Ginobili never playing during back to back games. We would remain fresh and ready all throughout the season. Our 2nd team squad is extremely solid just like it was this year.

The only real threat out of the West next season would be OKC again, Memphis, Dallas, and the Lakers. But I think the Lakers are imploding, Memphis is pretty solid but still think the Spurs have the clear advantage, and Dallas could be pretty good and really good if they get Deron Williams and/or Roy Hibbert.

And yes, Bonner will be back. Bet on it. He is a decent 10th player on the bench or a second squad player during the regular season. Playoff time, forget about it.

If things work out appropriately, Duncan signs for $7 million less for the next few seasons, we have a great shot next year, and a great shot at landing a quality star free agent in 2014, and I have a feeling it could be the Spurs and Thunder competiting in the WCF for the next 3-4 seasons.

The Spurs were right there with the Thunder. The Thunder were maybe 10% better. That athleticsm, youth, speed, long arms, and clutch shot after clutch shot, with Durant being the best player on the planet, was enough to slightly get the Thunder over the Spurs. And the refs helped the Thunder too in Game 6.

It wasn't like the Spurs got blown out every game by them. Every game was pretty close except game 3 and I expected that game from the Thunder with a blow out.

No major changes need to be made this off season. Just a quality PF/C and sign some of our players for 2-3 year contracts. And we shall see OKC next season again in the WCF I believe.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Your cap figures are way off. You can't sign all those players and give them raises. The Spurs are over the cap even with TD taking less. On the Bonner part. 10th man but he doesn't make 10th man money. Also play him only in the regular season??? So you're going to have a guy who makes close to 4 million per the next two seasons just to sit him for the playoffs? Sorry man makes no sense! Also playing the Big 3 mostly half a game according to your figures is not going to solve anything. You can't pay these guys big money to be on the floor half the time and win. You're giving full time star pay for part time production. Some of your other points seem fine but disagree on the points I stated above.

[ALSPURS]

I love that you trying but Lebron will never come to SA....

[joyner]

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL

Your cap figures are way off. You can't sign all those players and give them raises. The Spurs are over the cap even with TD taking less. On the Bonner part. 10th man but he doesn't make 10th man money. Also play him only in the regular season??? So you're going to have a guy who makes close to 4 million per the next two seasons just to sit him for the playoffs? Sorry man makes no sense! Also playing the Big 3 mostly half a game according to your figures is not going to solve anything. You can't pay these guys big money to be on the floor half the time and win. You're giving full time star pay for part time production. Some of your other points seem fine but disagree on the points I stated above.

Actually you are partly right. My numbers are a little off. I have figured this out now. Stay tuned to how I think the off season should be approached and the Spurs signings and who to let go. My salary numbers and who to keep perfectly add up, but it depends if Duncan wants to take $10 million for the next 2 seasons. That is the real million dollar question that would determine it all.

In regards to Lebron coming to San Antonio, why not? I think he might not want the limelight and the constant attention that he is getting in a big market area. I think he would feel refreshed and less pressure by coming to San Antonio. His personality could change by then. The Spurs will have a serious shot for him in 2014.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL

Your cap figures are way off. You can't sign all those players and give them raises. The Spurs are over the cap even with TD taking less. On the Bonner part. 10th man but he doesn't make 10th man money. Also play him only in the regular season??? So you're going to have a guy who makes close to 4 million per the next two seasons just to sit him for the playoffs? Sorry man makes no sense! Also playing the Big 3 mostly half a game according to your figures is not going to solve anything. You can't pay these guys big money to be on the floor half the time and win. You're giving full time star pay for part time production. Some of your other points seem fine but disagree on the points I stated above.

And I never said we could sign all of those players. The players I want signed are Mills and Jason Thompson, as well as Danny Green. Batun is awesome, but Leonard is a similar type of player, so that is out of the question.

[grizzly_bexar]

Neither Lebron James nor Dwayne Wade would ever come to San Antonio. That is the end of that. Those guys are in Miami and they own that city. San Antonio is a backwater, Podunk town in their eyes.

As far as Tim Duncan goes, I can see him signing for less, but not down to that 10 million for two years number that it would take for us to have any chance to sign a free-agent over the mid-level exception.

I have not crunched the numbers lately, but when I did I figured that Duncan would have to get down to that level for us to go over the mid-level exception to sign a free-agent. at this point, there really is no point to us re-signing Duncan at a massively lower salary, because we will need to use money to re-sign Danny Green and Boris DIaw. We can use the mid-level exception on boris, and we can use the Gilbert Arenas rule to re-sign Danny Green at an amount up to the mid-level exception without actually using it.

So unless we do not intend to re-sign Boris or Danny, duncan taking a pay cut only helps the owners bottom line, and not our actual roster flexibility.

[gosaspurs2150]

Here is this site that breaks it down nicely:

What Will The Spurs Salary Cap Look Like Next Year? - Pounding The Rock

So here it would be to sign, keep, and let go for this season in my humble opinion and let me know what you think.

Next Season Salary (Must be between $58 to $70 million. We can get up to $70 million before tax happens)

Duncan $12 mil (really depends if he wants to do this... 2 years at $12 million a year)
Parker $12.5 mil
Ginobili $14.1 mil
Splitter $4 mil
Leonard $1.9 mil
Neal $900 k
Jackson $10 mil
Green $3 mil (sign him for 2-3 years)
Mills $2.5 mil (sign him for 2-3 years)
Jason Thompson (Kings) Free agent signing $7 mil for 3-4 years

This would bring us to $66 million with about $2 million left over for 3 other roster spots. $1 million could be used for Blair possibly and $500k each for the other two spots.

Let go:

Joseph $1.1 mil salary next season gone
Blair $1 mil salary next season gone (depends on Duncan taking $12 mil a year)
Bonner $3.6 mil salary gone (for some type of cash or draft picks)
Diaw gone

In regards to Lebron and Wade in Miami by 2014, that could quickly change, especially if they lose tonight. If Lebron could reduce his salary to only $16 million a year to try to win a championship when he could have easily received $26 million a year, than I think Lebron in a few years would decide to go back to a small market team like the Spurs to try to win one. The Spurs will still have a nice core of talent at that time too.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

Here is this site that breaks it down nicely:

What Will The Spurs Salary Cap Look Like Next Year? - Pounding The Rock

So here it would be to sign, keep, and let go for this season in my humble opinion and let me know what you think.

Next Season Salary (Must be between $58 to $70 million. We can get up to $70 million before tax happens)

Duncan $12 mil (really depends if he wants to do this... 2 years at $12 million a year)
Parker $12.5 mil
Ginobili $14.1 mil
Splitter $4 mil
Leonard $1.9 mil
Neal $900 k
Jackson $10 mil
Green $3 mil (sign him for 2-3 years)
Mills $2.5 mil (sign him for 2-3 years)
Jason Thompson (Kings) Free agent signing $7 mil for 3-4 years

This would bring us to $66 million with about $2 million left over for 3 other roster spots. $1 million could be used for Blair possibly and $500k each for the other two spots.

Let go:

Joseph $1.1 mil salary next season gone
Blair $1 mil salary next season gone (depends on Duncan taking $12 mil a year)
Bonner $3.6 mil salary gone (for some type of cash or draft picks)
Diaw gone

In regards to Lebron and Wade in Miami by 2014, that could quickly change, especially if they lose tonight. If Lebron could reduce his salary to only $16 million a year to try to win a championship when he could have easily received $26 million a year, than I think Lebron in a few years would decide to go back to a small market team like the Spurs to try to win one. The Spurs will still have a nice core of talent at that time too.

How can you let go Joseph and Bonner? I'm sure teams would give you back some salary. What about euro guys they drafted recently that they want to bring in? They won't take chicken feed to come over. I don't see Wade and LeBron going to small market teams ever. But I like your pro active stance though.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

And I never said we could sign all of those players. The players I want signed are Mills and Jason Thompson, as well as Danny Green. Batun is awesome, but Leonard is a similar type of player, so that is out of the question.

You said keep Bonner now you want to move him?

[grizzly_bexar]

Sorry, that doesn't work (gosaspurs2150).

The way it works is you have the salary cap figure, and we are only "under" the cap by the amount of the cap minus our current salaries + cap holds (in other words, money that we will have to spend on free agents to fill out the minimum roster size.

With the guys we have currently signed through next year, not even counting our own free agents, we are at $48mil with 8 roster spots filled. To get to the minimum roster from there we'd have to add 5 guys, so that means about another $5mil counts against us for the cap (again, not even counting TD/Green/Mills/Diaw, but including Blair and Bonner as they are still under contract).

So without resigning TD we are about 5mil under the cap. That is about the amount of the MLE.

So there is no chance of us signing anybody good.

As I was thinking about it this afternoon, I realized all my assumptions from earlier this season about signing a big FA this year were assuming we amnestied RJ this offseason. Obviously that idea's gone.

There will be no free agent signing unless we have a significant roster overhaul.

Best we can do is trade guys like Bonner/Blair/Splitter that are good, productive guys with reasonable contracts, but not good enough to start on a championship team.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by grizzly_bexar

Sorry, that doesn't work (gosaspurs2150).

The way it works is you have the salary cap figure, and we are only "under" the cap by the amount of the cap minus our current salaries + cap holds (in other words, money that we will have to spend on free agents to fill out the minimum roster size.

With the guys we have currently signed through next year, not even counting our own free agents, we are at $48mil with 8 roster spots filled. To get to the minimum roster from there we'd have to add 5 guys, so that means about another $5mil counts against us for the cap (again, not even counting TD/Green/Mills/Diaw, but including Blair and Bonner as they are still under contract).

So without resigning TD we are about 5mil under the cap. That is about the amount of the MLE.

So there is no chance of us signing anybody good.

As I was thinking about it this afternoon, I realized all my assumptions from earlier this season about signing a big FA this year were assuming we amnestied RJ this offseason. Obviously that idea's gone.

There will be no free agent signing unless we have a significant roster overhaul.

Best we can do is trade guys like Bonner/Blair/Splitter that are good, productive guys with reasonable contracts, but not good enough to start on a championship team.

You're right it does not work salary wise and he moved the original projected salary numbers down too. That's why I suggested cutting the team's cap figure. They won't be free agent players this summer. Next summer they will. If they can move Bonner back to Toronto for a second rounder swap this draft and the pick they got from Indiana in the second round.(towards the very bottom of the draft) I would do that in a heartbeat! It goes from 5 to 9 million in cap space. That's huge if they can get creative on some other roster moves.

[grizzly_bexar]

We will re-sign Green as a FA using early Bird rights (don't have to use MLE, up to MLE money).

Mills has the option to go. I think he will.

Questions:

1) whether Joseph is ready to be backup PG. I doubt it, but he has the summer and training camp to show otherwise.

2) whether we want to re-sign Diaw, bring in one of our Euros (Lorbek, Richards), or go after another FA big man.

3) whether we want to move guys like Blair, Splitter, Bonner, Neal (who are good, but not good enough to be championship starters or even it appears rotation players), and/or move Joseph, who may be too young for a last run with this big 3.

[Kager]

Has anyone not been watching the Eastern Finals..... LBJ and Wade are not the answer, they are both passing off to franchise players like Haslem and Cole to take the clutch shots.

If we are going to head to Disneyland lets go for Durant who has delivered in the finals and was the difference.

[grizzly_bexar]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

And I never said we could sign all of those players. The players I want signed are Mills and Jason Thompson, as well as Danny Green. Batun is awesome, but Leonard is a similar type of player, so that is out of the question.

Bottom line is we can't sign anybody for over the MLE, unless possibly you dump out salary (Bonner), not re-sign Green or Diaw, and Duncan takes a 75% or greater pay cut.

Even then we're not talking much over mle.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL

You said keep Bonner now you want to move him?

I changed my mind. Just get rid of his salary to another team along with Corey Joseph that is about $4.6 million right there. We don't need much in return for that. Maybe some cash or a 2nd round pick. This will free up some room to sign Green and Mills for a few years each at about $2.5 million a year.

I don't think Mills is going to get over $3 million for any other team or a long term deal from any other team.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by grizzly_bexar

Bottom line is we can't sign anybody for over the MLE, unless possibly you dump out salary (Bonner), not re-sign Green or Diaw, and Duncan takes a 75% or greater pay cut.

Even then we're not talking much over mle.

My numbers perfectly add up. That is if we get rid of Bonner/Joseph salaries and Duncan takes $12 million next year. We wouldn't sign Diaw. I would prefer signing Jason Thompson for a 4 year deal at about $6-7 million a year. I can see Thompson leaving the Kings and them not signing him if they draft Drummond. A perfect opportunity for the Spurs to get a quality young 6'11'', athletic, nice shooting, and rebounder in Thompson who will fill the void of Duncan in a few years.

The other two needs are, sign a good back up for Parker. Mills fits perfectly. He is a lot more talented then Joseph. So far what I saw, I wasn't impressed with Joseph. He isn't a great shooter, he is not quick enough, and just an ok passer. Mills is better in every respect. We found our back up in Mills. We need to sign him for $3 million for maybe 3 years. Will another team sign him for more though or longer term?

The other need is a SG/SF, and that would be signing Green. He is a good defender, good outside shot, and think he will improve nicely. We need to sign him for $2.5-$3 million for maybe 3 years too. I can't see any other team signing him out there for more.

If we take care of these 3 issues, then the Spurs will still have a very solid deep bench and all of our needs will be met.

We can still keep Blair at a $1 million salary and still be under the $70 million tax cap.

This would also mean the 12th and 13th spot would be D-League players averaging $500,000 a year.

I am not impressed with de Colo or Lorbek from what I have read and seen in videos. So I am not even excited about these two prospects. I rather have an athletic US born player, like Jason Thompson or a Ryan Anderson. I don't want the Spurs turning into some all foreign team or the majority of the players on it.

[Kager]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

I am not impressed with de Colo or Lorbek from what I have read and seen in videos. So I am not even excited about these two prospects. I rather have an athletic US born player, like Jason Thompson or a Ryan Anderson. I don't want the Spurs turning into some all foreign team or the majority of the players on it.

Ummmm mate look around, our starting five has 3 foreign players, then the first two off the bench are foreign players.... infact TD, TP, Manu, Diaw (with more conditioning) and Splitter could be the starting five next year to counteract when big teams come to town.

The Spurs have always been the foreign player poster child of the NBA, so you may be trying to close the gate after the all american team has bolted.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by Kager

Ummmm mate look around, our starting five has 3 foreign players, then the first two off the bench are foreign players.... infact TD, TP, Manu, Diaw (with more conditioning) and Splitter could be the starting five next year to counteract when big teams come to town.

The Spurs have always been the foreign player poster child of the NBA, so you may be trying to close the gate after the all american team has bolted.

I said I don't want anymore foreign players for next year on this team. I think we can find better talent than de Colo and Lorbek here in the states.

Our main focus should be signing Mills, Thompson, and Green.

And letting go Joseph and Bonner for little to nothing in return.

[gosaspurs2150]

Next season we limit Duncan and Ginobili to 24 minutes a game. Parker would get about 28-30 min and rest Duncan and/or Ginobili on all back to back games.

If we sign Green, Mills, and get Jason Thompson, we are truly golden and of course remain healthy, we will end up in the WFC again and likely be a number 2 or 1 seed next season.

[Uwe Blab]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

I said I don't want anymore foreign players for next year on this team. I think we can find better talent than de Colo and Lorbek here in the states.

Our main focus should be signing Mills, Thompson, and Green.

And letting go Joseph and Bonner for little to nothing in return.

I hear ya on those guys. Lorbek is obviously an offensive minded player that won't help at all defensively. Basically, another Splitter. And I tried to warn people about Splitter. Foreign big men are soft.

As far as De Colo, he has some size for a PG, but not freakishly athletic or anything. He looks like he could be a good backup, but not next year.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by grizzly_bexar

We will re-sign Green as a FA using early Bird rights (don't have to use MLE, up to MLE money).

don't know about this especially since he sucked horribly late in the playoffs. if we're still trying to win a 'ship, he won't be back.

[gosaspurs2150]

Yeah, foreign big men are soft. Only big man that isn't I can think of his Dirk. Lorbek is out of the picture. Splitter is more skilled and better than he is or ever will be.

De Colo is a Beno Udrich player if that.

Give me a athletic US college born player over those two. I am sure there are better athletes and players on the Toros than those two.

And yes, I honestly do think we have a serious chance at landing Lebron James in a few years from now.

Two more seasons for him in Miami and I think he is out of there. He played in a small market city and team before with the CAVS, why not San Antonio?

Report: LeBron James may consider free agency in 2014; could he return to Cleveland?

Read more: Report: LeBron James may consider free agency in 2014; could he return to Cleveland? - NBA - Sporting News

With I think Duncan and Ginobili in a few years retiring, it could be hypothetically a 33 year old Parker, 30 year old Lebron, 23 year old Leonard, 27 year old Danny Green and hopefully a 28 year old Jason Thompson for the start of the 2014 season.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab

I hear ya on those guys. Lorbek is obviously an offensive minded player that won't help at all defensively. Basically, another Splitter. And I tried to warn people about Splitter. Foreign big men are soft.

Splitter still gave us defense. we had no post scoring. if Lorbek can do that, we should be fine. it should also depend if Duncan can actually rotate on defense without being 2-3 seconds late

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

don't know about this especially since he sucked horribly late in the playoffs. if we're still trying to win a 'ship, he won't be back.

He didn't suck against Utah nor the Clippers series. He had a few bad games against the Thunder but who didn't? They played aggressive defense that was beyond anything I have ever seen. Long, athletic and got into the minds of how the Spurs played.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

Splitter still gave us defense. we had no post scoring. if Lorbek can do that, we should be fine. it should also depend if Duncan can actually rotate on defense without being 2-3 seconds late

Lorbek has been labeled soft and not very athletic. No thanks. Splitter is fine enough. We need a strong, athletic American born player, like Jason Thompson or Ryan Anderson.

[gosaspurs2150]

I think it is pretty fair that Duncan reduces it to $12.5 million for the next two years, the same salary a prime Tony Parker makes now. Heck, Lebron makes $16 million and he is the 2nd best player in the NBA behind Durant.

Could Duncan get paid more elsewhere? Maybe. A team might sign him for $14-$15 million for the next two season, but that team will be completely different for Duncan and he doesn't like change. He would also likely have to play more demanding minutes and games for that team than for the Spurs. He totally wouldn't want to do that.

I think he will accept $12.5 mil or what Parker makes and this will be awesome for us and for our future!

[Uwe Blab]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

Splitter still gave us defense. we had no post scoring. if Lorbek can do that, we should be fine. it should also depend if Duncan can actually rotate on defense without being 2-3 seconds late

Jose, Splitter was iffy on defense. We know he can't block shots. He had tendencies to rotate too late, i.e. yesterday when Pop benched him. So all he has is positioning for the charge, but that only gets you so far because he's still slow on his feet.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

Lorbek has been labeled soft and not very athletic. No thanks. Splitter is fine enough. We need a strong, athletic American born player, like Jason Thompson or Ryan Anderson.

the guy from the Magic? all he does is shoot 3's and we know how that's fared with a certain redhead here

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by Uwe Blab

Jose, Splitter was iffy on defense. We know he can't block shots. He had tendencies to rotate too late, i.e. yesterday when Pop benched him. So all he has is positioning for the charge, but that only gets you so far because he's still slow on his feet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Td4Cru65bp0

Problem Solved!

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

the guy from the Magic? all he does is shoot 3's and we know how that's fared with a certain redhead here

Either him or Thompson. And yes Anderson. He is a much better rebounder than Bonner and more physical and can do much more than hit threes like Bonner can only do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbRHDx8P9k0

[gosaspurs2150]

If Kings draft Drummond than they likely wont make a long term offer for Thompson.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0kr-N4SoXo

[gosaspurs2150]

Spurs were number 8 this year.

HoopsHype - NBA Salaries

[alh1020]

When we start talking about the Spurs team makeup after Duncan/Ginobili decide to retire in coming years, there is one entity that needs to be factored into the equation that hasn't been spoken to so far -- will Popovich still have the desire to continue coaching. The rumor/gossip I've continued to hear is when Timmy goes, Pop will follow.

[gosaspurs2150]

I think it would depend if Duncan retires in 2 years. If that is the case, Pop would likely leave, and Mike Budenholzer would most likely be the head coach. Although if we can attract Lebron or another top free agent in 2014, then maybe Pop coaches for another 2 years after that. All hypothetical

[joyner]

LeBron will never play for San Antonio. Drop the pipe dream.

I used to think Pop would ride off into the sunset with Duncan, but I'm starting to think he's more likely to stick around. The way he's changed the team to an up-tempo brand of ball, Duncan and Ginobili retiring won't represent a major threat to the style. Duncan's a bit old to place in this set, and Ginobili's inconsistent as all get out.

Only problem is I don't see us rebuilding to contender status around Parker through mid-first round draft picks and free agent signings. I'm sure the Spurs of the post-Big 3 era can stay in the playoff picture built around Parker for a few years, but I don't see the ceiling any higher without some high draft picks.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

I said I don't want anymore foreign players for next year on this team. I think we can find better talent than de Colo and Lorbek here in the states.

Our main focus should be signing Mills, Thompson, and Green.

And letting go Joseph and Bonner for little to nothing in return.

I like Mills but Pop didn't play him. I agree on giving up on Joseph. He never impressed me. He had a second round draft grade by all accounts. Jeremy Tyler was the guy to get at #29 last summer.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

Lorbek has been labeled soft and not very athletic. No thanks. Splitter is fine enough. We need a strong, athletic American born player, like Jason Thompson or Ryan Anderson.

Ryan Anderson will want crazy money. And he will get it from someone. I'm not understanding why he has to be american born though? You don't want a Serge Ibaka on the Spurs?

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL

I like Mills but Pop didn't play him. I agree on giving up on Joseph. He never impressed me. He had a second round draft grade by all accounts. Jeremy Tyler was the guy to get at #29 last summer.

Pop played Mills when he rested Parker at the end of the season and he did amazing! Think he scored 30 points a couple of games. Of course Pop wouldn't play Mills in the playoffs since he was so new to the team, had to shorten the rotation, and didn't know all of the plays and system. And Mills wasn't playoff ready for that extra pressure.

Yeah, Jeremy Tyler could have been nice but a major project still.

And like I said, why not Lebron in 2014? If Duncan signs for 2 more years at $12 million and then we resign Ginobili for 1 more year after next season for $12 million, and both retire, that is $24 million off the books in 2014. That is enough to sign Lebron for 4-5 years at $90-$100 million.

Now if his next two seasons with Miami turn out to be failures, than he will start thinking otherwise about continuing with the Heat and signing with them that free agent year. He wouldn't go back to Cleveland and I don't think New York would have enough money then, nor LA to sign him. But lots of things can happen in 2 years of course. Lebron at that point though might want to play for another small market team again, especially if he hasn't won a championship by then. And with a core of Leonard, Parker and Lebron, that would be a nice trio there.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL

Ryan Anderson will want crazy money. And he will get it from someone. I'm not understanding why he has to be american born though? You don't want a Serge Ibaka on the Spurs?

Anderson might get anywhere between $8-$10 million. I think Thompson would be the better value.

A Serge Ibaka or a really good foreign player that is a really good big and who isn't soft is far and few between. Ibaka turned out to what we wanted from Mahimi. But since Mahimi has left he has looked pretty good. So I actually wouldn't mind signing him again for a couple of million next season.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

Pop played Mills when he rested Parker at the end of the season and he did amazing! Think he scored 30 points a couple of games. Of course Pop wouldn't play Mills in the playoffs since he was so new to the team, had to shorten the rotation, and didn't know all of the plays and system. And Mills wasn't playoff ready for that extra pressure.

Yeah, Jeremy Tyler could have been nice but a major project still.

And like I said, why not Lebron in 2014? If Duncan signs for 2 more years at $12 million and then we resign Ginobili for 1 more year after next season for $12 million, and both retire. That is $24 million off the books. Enough to sign Lebron for 4-5 years at $90-$100 million. Now if his next two seasons with Miami turn out to be failures, than he will start thinking otherwise about continuing with the Heat and signing with them that free agent year. He wouldn't go back to Cleveland and I don't think New York would have enough money then, nor LA to sign him. But lots of things can happen in 2 years of course. Lebron at that point though might want to play for another small market team again, especially if he hasn't won a championship by then.

I think Mills knew enough to play in the playoffs by now. Diaw came late too and started. But Mills playing garbage minutes or not playing at all to me is not a good sign for him to return. Yes I want him to return. Just seems unlikely. Tyler is a project but came on strong at the end of the year. I called for them to pick him if he was there. I did it at that time and who was a better pick at that point looking back? I just never rated Joseph as a first rounder period last summer. Mid second round if I had to choose. To me they blew that pick. The Kawhi trade was awesome and was much needed. I'm not against adding James BUT he won't come here. SA is small town to him. He wants a huge market. He has a media driven ego and he plays right now with two of his close friends.(Wade&Bosh) I'm not against your ideas at all but it coming true is just a pipe dream on the King James part. Why the change of heart on Bonner?

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by WILLTHETHRILL

I think Mills knew enough to play in the playoffs by now. Diaw came late too and started. But Mills playing garbage minutes or not playing at all to me is not a good sign for him to return. Yes I want him to return. Just seems unlikely. Tyler is a project but came on strong at the end of the year. I called for them to pick him if he was there. I did it at that time and who was a better pick at that point looking back? I just never rated Joseph as a first rounder period last summer. Mid second round if I had to choose. To me they blew that pick. The Kawhi trade was awesome and was much needed. I'm not against adding James BUT he won't come here. SA is small town to him. He wants a huge market. He has a media driven ego and he plays right now with two of his close friends.(Wade&Bosh) I'm not against your ideas at all but it coming true is just a pipe dream on the King James part. Why the change of heart on Bonner?

Maybe that is what CIA Pop wanted to do. Hide Mills in the playoffs so other teams might not see a true value in signing him for next season, which the Spurs would do. Neal/Parker/Ginobili were going to be our 3 point guards bringing up the ball. Parker increased his playing minutes to about 36 min a game. Never got into foul trouble. So that meant the remaining 12 min was Neal or Ginobili playing the point.

Tyler did come on strong but the Spurs wouldn't have drafted some young kid playing in Toyko as Bob Hill as his coach. LOL So Tyler remains to be seen if he is anything but decent in the next few years. He could easily flame out.

Well sure Lebron wanted to be with his buddies and with Pat Riley and the nice mansions on the beaches. Miami is not a LA or New York type of market but bigger than the CAVS or San Antonio. I would say San Antonio and Cleveland is on par as being equal small market teams. Lebron had no problems really being with the CAVS and a small market team. He wanted to win championships and he was getting all the attention he wanted for his big ego in Cleveland. He took possibly $8 million less than what he could have gotten for another team. He is making $16 million a year. He could have signed with Cleveland for likely $25 million a season. With an extra $8 million he could have bought a summer beach house mansion in Miami if he wanted to if he liked that area so much and remained in Cleveland. But it was the lure of being with his close friends, the super trio aura, and winning 6,7,8 championships.

For Bonner, he is a 3 point specialist, that is all. Him getting paid $3.4 million next season, I think we could package him and Joseph and clear $4.6 million right there to sign Mills and/or Green.

And yeah, Anderson would want about $8 to $10 million. I would pass on that. He actually didn't do very well against the Pacers in the playoffs. And his shooting % isn't all that great. He could have quite possibly overachieved last season.

[frenchfred]

I think that this is the end of the Spurs, they will have another good season next year but not enough to win. Looking at history they were never able to attract superstars so forget the Lebron in SA idea. The Spurs will have to go through the draft to get good players, which is going to be hard since they have low picks.

[gosaspurs2150]

Originally Posted by frenchfred

I think that this is the end of the Spurs, they will have another good season next year but not enough to win. Looking at history they were never able to attract superstars so forget the Lebron in SA idea. The Spurs will have to go through the draft to get good players, which is going to be hard since they have low picks.

They have a real good shot at going back to the WCF is things are played correctly this off season and next season. Anything can happen, but it does appear it could be Spurs/OKC again next season in the WCF as a 1 and 2 seed. I just don't see the Mavs, Lakers, Memphis, Utah, Clippers, getting the 1 or 2 seed next season, that is if all teams are fairly healthy.

Just a few little tweaks are needed to be made for the next 2 seasons. We have 2 seasons left with our big three. Sign Mills, Green, and Jason Thompson and we are set!

[theinswes]

i honestly believe Oden would be worth a look, IF we can still manage to get another big-man upfront and aren't relying on Oden to be a savior. he could be looking for a fresh start to get his career on track. 1) it's low risk if we have additional security, and 2) i'm that desperate after the realization that the twin towers effectively lasted about 3yrs and the rest of Tim's career he's had to take to the trenches with him Rasho, Malik, Nazr, Elson, Oberto, Bonner, Blair, Splitter and the only 2 respectable guys were way past their prime (Horry and Dyess, and yet they're still the best 2 we've had). we've given dude pathetic frontcourt pairings which he was able to overcome when he was in his prime, but it's harder to carry that load now he's older.

and no euro-big. they are soft, that's essentially a fact. the exceptions are basically Marc Gasol and Ibaka (Noah grew up in the US, and Marc also played h.s. in Mem). granted, more and more centers are turning soft, but i think the ideal is to look for the the american kids who know how to bang in the paint. Speights is an RFA but would bring both skill and the "i'm not a nice guy" vibe to the big man, and dude was basically gifted away to Memphis. the difference is Memphis VALUES that type of play (their entire team oozes that character), and honestly i don't think the Spurs do -- we're more of a finesse, passing, Euro team.

[joyner]

Why do we keep referring to Serge Ibaka as an example of a good Euro-big? He's from Congo. He played in Europe as a teenager, but by then the tenacity and toughness were already in him that Euro-bigs lack.

Any I'll repeat, LeBron isn't coming here. You can't say that "Lebron had no problems really being with the CAVS and a small market team." when he left the Cavs at his first opportunity. It's laughable to think he'd come here.

What LeBron wants is to be an international megastar without really trying. That's the reason he took less to sign with Wade and Bosh: he wants the championships to come easy, and he wants them to come in a city where he'll get recognition, praise, and fame. He's said in the past his goal is to be the first billionaire athlete, and he sees how Duncan has won championships without achieving much fame largely because of his market. He would never, ever, ever come to San Antonio, and to talk otherwise is nothing short of laughable.

[JuanCaca]

lebron gonna end in LA in 2014, not in san antonio.. even boston is more likely

[MichaelWi101]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

I said I don't want anymore foreign players for next year on this team. I think we can find better talent than de Colo and Lorbek here in the states.

Where? And how do the Spurs get them?

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by joyner

Why do we keep referring to Serge Ibaka as an example of a good Euro-big? He's from Congo. He played in Europe as a teenager, but by then the tenacity and toughness were already in him that Euro-bigs lack.

Any I'll repeat, LeBron isn't coming here. You can't say that "Lebron had no problems really being with the CAVS and a small market team." when he left the Cavs at his first opportunity. It's laughable to think he'd come here.

What LeBron wants is to be an international megastar without really trying. That's the reason he took less to sign with Wade and Bosh: he wants the championships to come easy, and he wants them to come in a city where he'll get recognition, praise, and fame. He's said in the past his goal is to be the first billionaire athlete, and he sees how Duncan has won championships without achieving much fame largely because of his market. He would never, ever, ever come to San Antonio, and to talk otherwise is nothing short of laughable.

Ibaka was born in the Congo. Where was Tony Parker born? Belguim not France. Steve Kerr? Lebanon. Yes Lebanon! Does not matter where they are born. Ibaka and Marc Gasol are not soft big men. Isn't Ibaka playing on the Spanish national team? Sounds kind of Euro to me.
On the LeBron stuff I agree with you 110% though.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Originally Posted by gosaspurs2150

Maybe that is what CIA Pop wanted to do. Hide Mills in the playoffs so other teams might not see a true value in signing him for next season, which the Spurs would do. Neal/Parker/Ginobili were going to be our 3 point guards bringing up the ball. Parker increased his playing minutes to about 36 min a game. Never got into foul trouble. So that meant the remaining 12 min was Neal or Ginobili playing the point.

Tyler did come on strong but the Spurs wouldn't have drafted some young kid playing in Toyko as Bob Hill as his coach. LOL So Tyler remains to be seen if he is anything but decent in the next few years. He could easily flame out.

Well sure Lebron wanted to be with his buddies and with Pat Riley and the nice mansions on the beaches. Miami is not a LA or New York type of market but bigger than the CAVS or San Antonio. I would say San Antonio and Cleveland is on par as being equal small market teams. Lebron had no problems really being with the CAVS and a small market team. He wanted to win championships and he was getting all the attention he wanted for his big ego in Cleveland. He took possibly $8 million less than what he could have gotten for another team. He is making $16 million a year. He could have signed with Cleveland for likely $25 million a season. With an extra $8 million he could have bought a summer beach house mansion in Miami if he wanted to if he liked that area so much and remained in Cleveland. But it was the lure of being with his close friends, the super trio aura, and winning 6,7,8 championships.

For Bonner, he is a 3 point specialist, that is all. Him getting paid $3.4 million next season, I think we could package him and Joseph and clear $4.6 million right there to sign Mills and/or Green.

And yeah, Anderson would want about $8 to $10 million. I would pass on that. He actually didn't do very well against the Pacers in the playoffs. And his shooting % isn't all that great. He could have quite possibly overachieved last season.

Random points:

Why hide Mills if they were losing in the series? Tyler and Bob Hill connection lol. Thats was funny. I hope that was not the reason. I think LeBron liked Cleveland because he was super close to home. Plus they drafted him in the first place. Not like he had a choice. Bonner will make 3.6 not 3.4 million. He is on the books for 3.9 million after next year. Joseph goes up to 1.1 million this coming year. I agree on moving out some salary.