Gary Neal assigned to Austin Toros

[Guille]

For medical rehab reasons. This means he´s closer to comeing back!
Yoohoo!

Spurs Assign Gary Neal to Austin for Rehab Assignment | THE OFFICIAL SITE OF THE SAN ANTONIO SPURS

[spurduncan21]

That's good hes coming back sooner than expected. Should be interesting how his return affects Anderson or Leornards' minutes. I'm pretty sure his return completely erases Danny Green's PT, while slightly affecting Anderson's minutes. Depth is a great problem for POP to have and definitely makes one of the guards expendable come time for a trade

[SleepyAdamII]

i think Neal comes back and Joseph goes to Austin. or back to Austin.

[Guille]

I don´t see Neal affecting Danny Green minutes. he´s sort of on the "bigs" list, closer to a Bonner type of role than what to expect from Neal.
I see him taking whatever minutes Joseph can make, and taking some minutes from Anderson and Kawhi (Anderson playing some Kawhi minutes, BTW)

[spurduncan21]

Didnt even think of Joseph since he sees the least PT of anyone. Pop really likes Ford, although Joseph has been much better than I anticipated. A stint in Austin would do him very well Sleepy

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

That's good hes coming back sooner than expected. Should be interesting how his return affects Anderson or Leornards' minutes. I'm pretty sure his return completely erases Danny Green's PT, while slightly affecting Anderson's minutes. Depth is a great problem for POP to have and definitely makes one of the guards expendable come time for a trade

Originally Posted by Guille

I don´t see Neal affecting Danny Green minutes. he´s sort of on the "bigs" list, closer to a Bonner type of role than what to expect from Neal.
I see him taking whatever minutes Joseph can make, and taking some minutes from Anderson and Kawhi (Anderson playing some Kawhi minutes, BTW)

i hope both of you are wrong. Neal is a PG (in height and he's practiced it), he should be taking minutes from TJ Ford and his pathetic play. no need to punish the 2 guys who have been key to why we've won games. at least Neal gives us a shooter while Ford gives us nothing.

can you imagine a backcourt of Ford and Neal? there goes any defense we had before (especially with Bonner in there)

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Guille

I don´t see Neal affecting Danny Green minutes. he´s sort of on the "bigs" list, closer to a Bonner type of role than what to expect from Neal.
I see him taking whatever minutes Joseph can make, and taking some minutes from Anderson and Kawhi (Anderson playing some Kawhi minutes, BTW)

Im pretty sure Kawhi's getting his 15mpg regardless. No way Neal takes any of his PT at SF. If anyone would be taking PT from Kawhi, it's none other than James Anderson, who can play SF for a short period of time

[Guille]

Yeah, but Pop likes TJ. He´ll still have his minutes. And Pop will play Neal at the 2.
Although probably Neal will take some of TJ Ford´s minutes, and I agree with you, he should.

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

i hope both of you are wrong. Neal is a PG (in height and he's practiced it), he should be taking minutes from TJ Ford and his pathetic play. no need to punish the 2 guys who have been key to why we've won games. at least Neal gives us a shooter while Ford gives us nothing.

can you imagine a backcourt of Ford and Neal? there goes any defense we had before (especially with Bonner in there)

Neal showed last year that HE clearly is not a PG. He's working on dribbling and passing much like Roger Mason Jr did and we all know that turned out. He's a shooter and would have to show alot upon his return to make me think otherwise.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

Neal showed last year that HE clearly is not a PG. He's working on dribbling and passing much like Roger Mason Jr did and we all know that turned out. He's a shooter and would have to show alot upon his return to make me think otherwise.

Anderson has handled the ball really well off the bench and has contributed to movement. i'd hate to think the only reason we're playing TJ Ford is because he can dribble just so he can then drive to the basket, then either get blocked or miss the shot horribly like he has (and defensively he's been beyond pathetic). i don't think Pop is in love with TJ like he was with Hill (and Mason was really our only backup guard who could remotely play that position because he tried it in Washington). our better interest offensively and defensively is Neal as our backup point or else you'd be seeing:

Ford/Neal/Leonard/Bonner/Splitter off the bench and that's a horrible offensive and defensive lineup (with Neal guarding the SG and Bonner losing the help Anderson/Leonard both give him when he gets posted up). Neal played it way better than Mason and he wasn't strictly a "pick and pop" guy like Mason was. he showed he had that little floater driving to the lane but was most comfortable just spotting up, which he can still do as the backup PG

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

Anderson has handled the ball really well off the bench and has contributed to movement. i'd hate to think the only reason we're playing TJ Ford is because he can dribble just so he can then drive to the basket, then either get blocked or miss the shot horribly like he has (and defensively he's been beyond pathetic). i don't think Pop is in love with TJ like he was with Hill (and Mason was really our only backup guard who could remotely play that position because he tried it in Washington). our better interest offensively and defensively is Neal as our backup point or else you'd be seeing:

Ford/Neal/Leonard/Bonner/Splitter off the bench and that's a horrible offensive and defensive lineup (with Neal guarding the SG and Bonner losing the help Anderson/Leonard both give him when he gets posted up). Neal played it way better than Mason and he wasn't strictly a "pick and pop" guy like Mason was. he showed he had that little floater driving to the lane but was most comfortable just spotting up, which he can still do as the backup PG

Pop had Hill here for years and that "love" developed over plenty of time. Ford is a serviceable pg and Pop knows to be patient with him since he's still finding his comfort zone in the system. His shots will begin to fall as will TD's.

As mentioned earlier, when Neal returns we'll have too many sg and sf's, which makes me think that a trade will happen to alleviate the burden of finding PT for everyone. Neal's absence has shown POP that someone will be expendable when he returns. I just hope its Neal rather than Anderson since I'm a big fan of his. I do not dislike Bonner, but the man should not be seeing more than 10mpg and hope he's included in any trade. Most likely though, it will be Blair since he's currently playing the best 4 game stretch of NBA ball than any he has ever had.

[Guille]

I really think Pop will make Ford and Neal play some backup PG minutes.
Neal and Anderson some backupg SG minutes
and Anderson and Kawhi some SF minutes
Maybe even playing Kawhi some PF small ball minutes.
Good thing we have depth, but Pop has to give everybody minutes, and this will also help keep Manu around 25-30, rather than the thirty something of last season and Tony on 30-35.
Still worried about the bigs minutes.

[SleepyAdamII]

I'd like to see Splitter/Leonard/Anderson/Neal/Ford coming off the bench, that would be a very imposing force.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by SleepyAdamII

I'd like to see Splitter/Leonard/Anderson/Neal/Ford coming off the bench, that would be a very imposing force.

no love for the Hoagie Hunter?!

[Jose_TheGenius]

i'm gonna say it, i didn't want to, but i must:

i dislike Ford in the game more than Bonner. in fact, i haven't minded Bonner since he's gotten some help on D. TJ Ford though? no thanks. give me Matty Thrice, as Maurice calls him, any day over Ford.


Update: Hell has frozen over

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by SleepyAdamII

I'd like to see Splitter/Leonard/Anderson/Neal/Ford coming off the bench, that would be a very imposing force.

On the offensive yes I concur, but leaves much to be desired on the defensive end. We'd be facing mismatches at the SG and PF positions in that hypothetical lineup. I'd prefer to place Bonner at the PF than to have Leornard play long stretches at PF. RJ's been playing alot with the second unit, so he'd probably be favored at playing PF than Leornard mainly due to the fact that he's a bit stronger. RJ has had a problem playing PF in the past

[Guille]

I really don´t see us trading Gary Neal. He´s making 788k. What can we get for that money??? Unless he´s involved in a multiplayer, we won´t get anything in return for him.

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

i'm gonna say it, i didn't want to, but i must:

i dislike Ford in the game more than Bonner. in fact, i haven't minded Bonner since he's gotten some help on D. TJ Ford though? no thanks. give me Matty Thrice, as Maurice calls him, any day over Ford.


Update: Hell has frozen over

IF Ford's shot had been falling I doubt you'd be feeling this way. Yes he's made mistakes on the offensive end with turnovers and shots have clearly not been going in, but the reality is he's new to this system. Since he's the backup PG, his learning curve has to be shorter than any of the positions. Just give it a little more time Jose

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Guille

I really don´t see us trading Gary Neal. He´s making 788k. What can we get for that money??? Unless he´s involved in a multiplayer, we won´t get anything in return for him.

Blair + Neal with a pick = Cousins. Sacramento is below the tax threshold, so they could soak up the difference in salary

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

On the offensive yes I concur, but leaves much to be desired on the defensive end. We'd be facing mismatches at the SG and PF positions in that hypothetical lineup. I'd prefer to place Bonner at the PF than to have Leornard play long stretches at PF. RJ's been playing alot with the second unit, so he'd probably be favored at playing PF than Leornard mainly due to the fact that he's a bit stronger. RJ has had a problem playing PF in the past

actually then you'd actually be going against your theory on defense if you play Neal/Ford/Bonner together off the bench because you're going to have Ford getting burned by the opposing PG like he has, then Neal guarding a guy 4-5 inches taller than him (and he has no wingspan) with Bonner who's not a good help defender (and a worse man defender).

Leonard, as much as i would loathe him to play the PF position, would at least give you speed and a mismatch on offense (especially if he can make 3's). at least he'll tire out the opposing PF running around setting picks and moving the ball where it can effect the other big's offense.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

Blair + Neal with a pick = Cousins. Sacramento is below the tax threshold, so they could soak up the difference in salary

tried it on ESPN.com Trade Machine and it failed because we'd have to throw in more (we're the ones over the salary cap and that's a $2 mill or so difference)

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

actually then you'd actually be going against your theory on defense if you play Neal/Ford/Bonner together off the bench because you're going to have Ford getting burned by the opposing PG like he has, then Neal guarding a guy 4-5 inches taller than him (and he has no wingspan) with Bonner who's not a good help defender (and a worse man defender).

Leonard, as much as i would loathe him to play the PF position, would at least give you speed and a mismatch on offense (especially if he can make 3's). at least he'll tire out the opposing PF running around setting picks and moving the ball where it can effect the other big's offense.

Not really going against what I said. RJ will be in that unit as will Bonner so theres no way around that. Whomever is at SG (Neal or Ford) will get abused on the defensive end. As far as PF, I'd take Leornard over Bonner since he's quick and get up quick, but needs to show that he can make the 3 consistently. Currently shooting like low 30% so he can certainly show more than that. We've been through this before, Bonner will get his minutes as much as I hate it. The fact is we do NOT have bigs meaning they will all be playing. If anything, when Neal does return, Ford's PT goes down and Neal gets a shot at both point and SG positions.

[Guille]

Yeah but that way we are giving away two good contributors that are underpaid, and we go further into luxury tax territory. Not seeing it happening.
That way Sacto drops more salary, not us.
Between Blair and Neal it´s 1.7M, Cousins is making a little over 3M.
We are not making that one.
Bonner + Pick
Bonner + Neal + Pick
and we can dump some salary. If not we are not able to make it.
I don´t see us giving Blair (you cannot get 16ppg 8 rpg at 800k anywhere)

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

Not really going against what I said. RJ will be in that unit as will Bonner so theres no way around that.

bringing RJ off the bench? you'd be risking killing the chemistry and putting him on a slump since he's playing hot right now (he's one of the reasons we're running because he can't play in a set offense successfully). he could turn into Blair 2.0 from last year after playing really well just to get benched then give little effort. Neal coming back should in no way effect our starting lineup, at all. you have to look at it from a bench point of view and who gets bumped down to 3rd string.

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

tried it on ESPN.com Trade Machine and it failed because we'd have to throw in more (we're the ones over the salary cap and that's a $2 mill or so difference)

Yeah Its true. Those would be the two main pieces that would get shipped out. If the Kings include a low salaried person and we ship out Bonner in addition to Neal and Blair, the trade works. That trade machine does NOT enable us to use the trade exception from the George Hill trade

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

bringing RJ off the bench? you'd be risking killing the chemistry and putting him on a slump since he's playing hot right now (he's one of the reasons we're running because he can't play in a set offense successfully). he could turn into Blair 2.0 from last year after playing really well just to get benched then give little effort. Neal coming back should in no way effect our starting lineup, at all. you have to look at it from a bench point of view and who gets bumped down to 3rd string.

Where have you been? Leornard has been the first reserve off the bench for RJ and RJ only to be coming in at the end of the first or a couple of minutes into the second. Needless to say, RJ's been seeing more PT with the second unit and even said recently that he's more comfortable with that unit than ever before

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

Yeah Its true. Those would be the two main pieces that would get shipped out. If the Kings include a low salaried person and we ship out Bonner in addition to Neal and Blair, the trade works. That trade machine does NOT enable us to use the trade exception from the George Hill trade

that's a great trade for us, but when you think of trades, you have to also think about it from Sac's view point:

- why take in Matt Bonner's bloated long contract?
- is Neal going to cause problems because he won't play? they already got Evans/Jimmer/Thomas in the PG slots (plus their actual SG's)

from a realistic view, they would only take this trade if they thought Blair was going to be a really really good player. there's no reason to "just take Bonner's deal" so he can be the 3rd/4th/5th big off the bench who's overpaid over the young guys they have (that's why we can't trade him at all if we wanted to, ala RJ Syndrome). same with Neal because they don't need him. you're better off trying to include Splitter over Bonner (who we won't give up for Cousins since Tiago's been superb) to convince them to do the deal.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by spurduncan21

Where have you been? Leornard has been the first reserve off the bench for RJ and RJ only to be coming in at the end of the first or a couple of minutes into the second. Needless to say, RJ's been seeing more PT with the second unit and even said recently that he's more comfortable with that unit than ever before

been watching the games and knowing RJ has been starting. just like when Parker was a reserve in 2010 and hated it. there's a diff starting the game and sitting then playing again over sitting cold.

there's a reason why Manu is praised to come off the bench even if he plays starter minutes, because it's a rhythm killer unless you can do it.

by the way, you'd have to agree that running the ball has benefited RJ and RJ can't swing the ball like an Anderson or a Leonard (or move as fast as them) so there wouldn't be much of a running game with RJ and those other guys in there like he has with 2 guys who can pass naturally like he's been used with Kidd.

[spurduncan21]

Even Bonner and Neal straight-up for Cousins works in that trade machine giving us +6 in the wins department and we get to keep Blair.

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

been watching the games and knowing RJ has been starting. just like when Parker was a reserve in 2010 and hated it. there's a diff starting the game and sitting then playing again over sitting cold.

there's a reason why Manu is praised to come off the bench even if he plays starter minutes, because it's a rhythm killer unless you can do it.

by the way, you'd have to agree that running the ball has benefited RJ and RJ can't swing the ball like an Anderson or a Leonard (or move as fast as them) so there wouldn't be much of a running game with RJ and those other guys in there like he has with 2 guys who can pass naturally like he's been used with Kidd.

I'll agree POP started running more last year to fully utilize his players potential and make the system work for them as opposed to the other way. The system this year is the same as last years, except we have a deeper and more established team. RJ has been seeing more PT with the second unit than ever before. The reason he starts is so that he's not utterly useless coming off the bench cold. He gets a little run with the starters, only to be replaced by Leornard and then thrusted into the second where he can excel and get more shots.

[katyspursfan]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

- why take in Matt Bonner's bloated long contract?
- is Neal going to cause problems because he won't play? they already got Evans/Jimmer/Thomas in the PG slots (plus their actual SG's)

I'll be the first to suggest it.

Why is a $3M/year contract for the best 3 point shooter in the league a 'bloated long term contract'?

If the Spurs had a one dimensional defensive player playing for the exact same contract, it would unlikely be labeled as either bloated or long term.
Shoot, there's a guy in HOU that's a one dimensional offensive player that CAN'T shoot the three, making 3 times that amount. Yet, he's a bargain, nee deity?

Yup, mention the playoffs. Bonner hasn't showed. That puts him inline with all the bigs on the Spurs in the playoffs. And most of the guards. Bonner is NOT the reason the Spurs haven't advanced in forever. But he's certainly not a contributing factor to why they DIDN'T advance.

[spurduncan21]

Originally Posted by katyspursfan

I'll be the first to suggest it.

Why is a $3M/year contract for the best 3 point shooter in the league a 'bloated long term contract'?

If the Spurs had a one dimensional defensive player playing for the exact same contract, it would unlikely be labeled as either bloated or long term.
Shoot, there's a guy in HOU that's a one dimensional offensive player that CAN'T shoot the three, making 3 times that amount. Yet, he's a bargain, nee deity?

Yup, mention the playoffs. Bonner hasn't showed. That puts him inline with all the bigs on the Spurs in the playoffs. And most of the guards. Bonner is NOT the reason the Spurs haven't advanced in forever. But he's certainly not a contributing factor to why they DIDN'T advance.

Youre right, by no means is Bonner a bloated contract.

[tenthousandaces]

Jose,
If I ever see that lineup on the floor (Ford/Neal/Leonard/Bonner/Splitter) I'll be thinking of you!

Apart from Ford, there would be mediocre ball-handling, and apart from Leonard and Splitter, a weak defense.

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by katyspursfan

I'll be the first to suggest it.

Why is a $3M/year contract for the best 3 point shooter in the league a 'bloated long term contract'?

If the Spurs had a one dimensional defensive player playing for the exact same contract, it would unlikely be labeled as either bloated or long term.
Shoot, there's a guy in HOU that's a one dimensional offensive player that CAN'T shoot the three, making 3 times that amount. Yet, he's a bargain, nee deity?

Yup, mention the playoffs. Bonner hasn't showed. That puts him inline with all the bigs on the Spurs in the playoffs. And most of the guards. Bonner is NOT the reason the Spurs haven't advanced in forever. But he's certainly not a contributing factor to why they DIDN'T advance.

$3 million for a bench player to just be 1 dimensional? not gonna argue about it, we each have our opinions (mainly because Bonner isn't my most disliked Spur this year). this argument on Bonner's play justifying his deal could be as exhausting as us arguing how Scola would do with the Spurs.

Originally Posted by tenthousandaces

Jose,
If I ever see that lineup on the floor (Ford/Neal/Leonard/Bonner/Splitter) I'll be thinking of you!

Apart from Ford, there would be mediocre ball-handling, and apart from Leonard and Splitter, a weak defense.

[Dr. Real]

Are we really proposin Neal in a trade for Cousins? What has Cousin done to draw that type of attention?

[Jose_TheGenius]

Originally Posted by Dr. Real

Are we really proposin Neal in a trade for Cousins? What has Cousin done to draw that type of attention?

he's tall. we just need a tall person, haven't you heard?!

[Dr. Real]

Originally Posted by Jose_TheGenius

he's tall. we just need a tall person, haven't you heard?!

I get that but Cousins???? I'd pass on him. Chemistry is important to the Spurs. We can deal with guys who have an attitude but not that type. He'd really have to be an outstandin talent to sacrifice Neal.

He hasn't really shown enough to warrant sacrificin a knock-down shooter like Neal. We need Neal's toughness and marksmenship. If we give him up, it better be for someone who isn't comin in to loaf, complain and whine.

[WILLTHETHRILL]

Random points:

Gary Neal is not a point guard. point guard height? emergency point? Yes and yes. Not an NBA point guard!

Why trade Blair? He is playing good and his contract is cap friendly.

Bonner's contract sucks period. Yes he is the 3 point champ but what else does he do well??? Thank you!

In a way I see why people want RJ off the bench. He plays bad when TD is the game with him. He plays better with the second unit because he becomes the focal point. Don't bring up how he plays with Manu because Manu fits in with almost 99% of NBA players. Even with TP you would think he would be better with a top 10 point guard.

Kawhi to me is not an NBA power forward. He has even played SG at least in one of the games.(preseason too) I like his energy off the bench though.

I'm not big on TJ Ford but Pop is going to play him. His shooting distance sucks but he is steady. Pop is stubborn so don't expect Joseph anytime soon even if he gets the better of TJ in practice.(if does at all)

Cousins? Well he is a head case. Lots of talent though. I just don't see the Kings moving him. westpahl sucks. He needs to leave anyway. I would not go that route. I know I said no more stop gaps but seems the Spurs are not going to go above the minimum to sign anyone so just sign Erik Dampier. Yeah he is old but he could give them a big center. He enforces too. They need a guy with some edge and he fits the bill. I know someone will knock this down fast but it's obvious the Spurs are going low cost the rest of the way. Might as well be him for a one year deal. If you do knock it down then please give me your solution. I'm curious to know if your suggestion is in the realm of reality.